Ptolus at Amazon?

[BSF]

You never worked in the PR field, eh?

What you -do- say is "hey, we offered them the same deal the LGS' distributors get. They turned us down. What can we do?"

You -don't- say "We made sure book distributors didn't get a shot at this book."

*laugh*

Nope! Never worked PR. It is a fair observation. Maybe you ought to contact Malhavoc to handle PR?

 

[Bobitron]

You have folks that want a discount.

You have folks that need a discount.

Nobody needs a discount on this stuff. It is, to be blunt, luxury goods. The thousands of dollars I spent of gaming books I 'need' is just silly.

I preordered it from WW. Who knows, I might find it to "be bigger, better, more useful, and prettier than any other roleplaying product your gaming group has ever seen." It might sit on my shelf next to other great products I own that never get used. I have high hopes based on the quality of the $3 Player's Guide I bought.

As for the distribution thing, I don't fault Monte for restricting the distribution of a luxury item. Heck, every other industry does it, why not a game designer? It helps maintain a feeling of exclusivity for those of us willing to spend over $100 for a book.

I applaud his symbolic gesture of making it available in only game stores and through certain online retailers, even though it is honestly a drop in the bucket. If every FLGS sold a dozen of them, it would make for a nice week or two. We're not going to be talking about Ptolus in a few months and saying it saved the industry.

I buy gaming stuff from a few sources; an FLGS or two, Borders/Barnes and Noble, Amazon, a couple other online retailers, and RPGNow/DriveThruRPG. If a local store doesn't have a book I want in stock, sure, I'll get it from Amazon. You've got to be kidding if you think I'm going to special order it from an LGS and wait 2-3 weeks, then pay full price plus tax when I can have it in a few days for less money from Amazon.

People who say the Amazon thing has turned them off from buying the book are discount shoppers. Your finances don't dictate Monte's distribution; the market and his whims do.

I love the idea of Ptolus as it is being presented. I hope it is a smashing success and other products in a similar vein follow.

 

[Treebore]

There is one HUGE difference in how Necromancer Games is handling RA:R versus Monte and Ptolus. They aren't refusing to sell through Amazon and claiming to be doing it to stand by LGS' and the "little guys".

In fact, Necromancer has outright said that doing pre-orders is keeping the LGS' from getting the sale and requested that if we didn't pre-order to please buy it through an LGS so they can get some support. This is with RA:R only having a print run of 1,000. Necromancer isn't saying one thing while doing another. They said black is black and white is white.

If Monte really wants to stand by the LGS' then cancel and refund the pre-orders! Make everyone buy Ptolus through an LGS!

Otherwise quit being a hypocrit and sell to Amazon.

I have read enough of Monte's commentary to believe he likes to be a "straight shooter", so I realize that Monte has accidentally put himself in a position of hypocrisy. We all do it sooner or later, again and again, its one of those parts of "being human". He does have the ability to fix it. He can either fully stand by the LGS' and cancel the pre-orders and give refunds and sell ALL copies through LGS', or he can sell to Amazon as well, or he can keep things as they are.

I will pre-order Ptolus through Amazon, using my $25 gift certificate, and see if I get lucky, though.

Of course if Monte does sell to Amazon he will also be in a bit of a pickle, because he promised the pre-ordering people that it would not be available through Amazon at a discount. There are posters on his boards right now bringing that up, or at least earlier today.

I saw no such promise on the pre-order pages, but apparently he said something to that effect somewhere, or several people who pre-ordered seriously misunderstood something.

 

[Siobharek]

You saw my post on page 2, right?


Peace and smiles

j.

Well, I did NOW...

Sorry

 

[Numion]

Nobody needs a discount on this stuff. It is, to be blunt, luxury goods. The thousands of dollars I spent of gaming books I 'need' is just silly.

He probably meant by need a situation in which someone would buy Ptolus with Amazon discount, but not at the full price. Want applies to me - I would've liked for Amazon to get a shot at this, even though I went and bought it at full price.

As for the distribution thing, I don't fault Monte for restricting the distribution of a luxury item. Heck, every other industry does it, why not a game designer? It helps maintain a feeling of exclusivity for those of us willing to spend over $100 for a book.

Well, that's not how it really works in luxury items. You don't really get any sort of exclusive feeling when buying it from a clueless fatbeard working at 'The Games Pit'

People who say the Amazon thing has turned them off from buying the book are discount shoppers. Your finances don't dictate Monte's distribution; the market and his whims do.

I don't know if they're discount shoppers (is that some kind of negative thing in USA?) - maybe they just feel that this is more of a price fixing situation. The extra money is like subsidies to gaming stores. I might've set my opinions too strongly, I mean I still bought it

 

[rpghost]

Here is something from Fred from PSI (White Wolfs book trade division):

There has been some concern that Amazon.com is currently listing Ptolus at $75, a rather heavily discounted price. THEY ARE NOT GOING TO GET THE BOOK. It is very hard to prevent Amazon from listing something. They hear of it, they put it up. We will not be shipping this book to any book trade customers or distributors who service mass book trade (Ingram, etc.). The orders on Amazon.com will not be filled.

That's not to say that Amazon associates or Hobby stores with web sites won't discount, but those books will come through Hobby Distribution. White-wolf.com will maintain the MSRP.

The disappointing thing is that consumers may get the idea that they are getting the book cheap, but in reality they won't get the book at all.

Here are some words from Monte Cook as well.

Regards,

Fred Yelk Woodruff
Director of Sales
Publisher Services, Inc.

 

[Bobitron]

I don't know if they're discount shoppers (is that some kind of negative thing in USA?) - maybe they just feel that this is more of a price fixing situation.

I didn't mean it that way. Sorry if it came across like that.

I just get annoyed with people who refuse to buy something unless it is below the suggested retail price. It often has nothing to do with what they can afford and everything to do with feeling they got a deal.

 

[Barak]

See, again, they make it sound like like they are not shipping the book to the distributors who service Amazon out of spite, and not because said distributors "screw them over" in any way. Which, as a customer, is annoying as heck.

 

[Barak]

I didn't mean it that way. Sorry if it came across like that.

I just get annoyed with people who refuse to buy something unless it is below the suggested retail price. It often has nothing to do with what they can afford and everything to do with feeling they got a deal.

Hey Marcel

In my case, it has nothing to do with wether or not I can afford it. If I really wanted Ptolus, I'd get it anyway. Of course, it would affect the number of other books I'd get. I do have a -limited- amount of money I spend on gaming books, and if I spend 120$ on one instead of 75$, well, that's 45$ worth of other books I won't get.

 

[JustaPlayer]

I will pre-order Ptolus through Amazon, using my $25 gift certificate, and see if I get lucky, though.

Exact same with me. I'll take my shot at $50. If they don't get it, no big deal. I'm sure I can get it at my friends games stor for 20% off if I really feel that I want it.

I think WW fails to realize that Amazon gets things from gaming distributors all well though.