Publishers Opinion Of PCGen

Status
Not open for further replies.
Morrus said:


Me to Gaming Report? I've never mentioned this to anyone at Gaming Report. Why would I - my job is to rpeort news myself, not to give it to others to report.

As for PCGen being mentioned by name - that's all the info I had, and I mentioned it in a thread on these boards. Had I more info, I would have reported that too. Such is the nature of news reporting. You'll notice that your side of the issue was presented at length, very visibly in orange writing, on the news page.

Ah, the way it was reported by them (Gaming Report), it made it look as if you had indeed reported to them. Perhaps in casual conversation, perhaps directly, but looking back through everything, I see now how that happened. Clarification occurs. ;p

And yes you did post that in big orange letters on the main page and we are very appreciative of that fact. As I said, it _looked_ like an attack, I didn't say it was, just that it looked that way to me after everything else that's been going on.

I don't lntend to sit back and let people attack mercilessly anyone/thing... it's not in my nature to do so, nor do I intend to attack anyone/thing mercelessly. I try ot look at every side of an argument/debate/discussion and base my responses off of that, but I am human (contrary to any stories otherwise. :p) and I do understand that everyone else is as well, and people are people and _DO_ make mistakes, it's how we handle making those mistakes that tells who is willing to live, learn, move on, from those that are simply around to cause problems. *shrug*
 

log in or register to remove this ad

Morrus said:
This thread is coming very close to being closed. In fact, just one more rant or angry rebuttal will do it.

Folks, if you have questions, ask them. PCGen folk - if the questions make you angry, don't answer them. If not, I for one am very interested in hearing what you have to say.

Okay, fair enough, no more rants from me then.

Fire away on the questions.
 

Question

Why haven't you answered Morrus' questions about your intentions? I will repeat them here:

why wasn't PCGEN compliant?

did you guys do so because you felt you were getting away with it? Or did you honestly believe that you were OK, legally? Or were you under the impression that, lacking a dialogue with WotC, you had the right to do what you liked and that they had some kind of "responsibility" to talk to you and tell you how to do it?



These are not attacks, or slander (heh), they are questions that remain unanswered. They are also very germane, or should be, to publishers considering adding content to the program.
 

Re: Question

d20Dwarf said:
Why haven't you answered Morrus' questions about your intentions? I will repeat them here:

why wasn't PCGEN compliant?

did you guys do so because you felt you were getting away with it? Or did you honestly believe that you were OK, legally? Or were you under the impression that, lacking a dialogue with WotC, you had the right to do what you liked and that they had some kind of "responsibility" to talk to you and tell you how to do it?



These are not attacks, or slander (heh), they are questions that remain unanswered. They are also very germane, or should be, to publishers considering adding content to the program.

Okay, those questions have been answered, repeatedly, but I will do so again.

PCGen was not trying to get 'away' with anything, we did not feel WotC 'owed us' anything, and yes we are within legal rights of copyright law.
 


No, they havent been answered. You were told over and over on the d20 lists that PCGen wasnt compliant. Ryan even said it (back when he was with WotC). I believe SSS even asked you to remove the SSS-based content from your files. That was a long time ago. Everyone was telling you that you werent OGL compliant. But you didnt do anything until WotC came to you. Why was that? Thats all we want to know.

As far as attacks on me, I dont care about that. Frankly things speak for themselves when you ask for opinions and then cry when you get them.

As for Mynex's comment:

1 Message states that no way in hell is NG going to be in PCGen, then it's 'wait and see for a year', then it's 'if WotC asked me I would license to them', nevermind the fact that he's blatantly slammed us for 'not being compliant', then he turns around and would give the the nod to another piece of software that wasn't?

The differnce from one to two was giving you a break. I thought you were irresponsible before, but if you play properly for a reasonable period of time I would reconsider. If you want, I can go back to my first position of "no way."

As for my decision to license things to etools, PCGen and etools are different and the content would be handled by different licenses. I dont care if you understand the difference or not. The bottom line is it is my content and my call about who to license it to.

You all can spin it however you want.

Clark
 


We ARE within copyright laws. People seem to forget that. Don't believe me? contact a copyright and software lawyer, ask them.

I am an attorney and no you weren't in compliance. Your use was not within the fair use exception and the material you were using was released pursuant to a specific license that you were not in compliance with.

As for PCGen being singled out, I thought this thread was "Publishers Opinions of PCGen"?

Clark
 

I used to use PCGen although I switched to Campaign Suite. I hold no animosity towards PCGen and will agree that the material I saw in it would not be useful if the user did not own the original product.

However, I do have some questions that have cropped up before or I've wondered myself. This seems like the ideal place to ask them, if for no other reason than to allow a public response from various publishers.


1) Clark, Wil, and others. I'm not a legal whiz. I'm not a publisher. However, it seems to me that when you claim you're d20 compliant (by placing the logo on your product) then the burden of action is not on you to get some sort of certification of compliancy - rather, the burden is on WotC to determine on their own and send a C&D or open up some dialogue.

In otherwords, if FFG or NG were to publish a product and place a d20 System Logo on it, they are not required to go to WotC and get it approved. Rather, if WotC has a problem with it, they will get in contact with the publisher.

Am I right on this?

If I'm right does this also apply to software vendors?

2) I also would like an answer to Morrus' questions.

3) Mynex or other PCGen folks, could you comment as to the compatability of the OGL/d20 STL with software licenses, such as the CopyLeft?

4) Are there any legal cases supporting the defense of "fair use" with regard to including OGC if a given product is not OGL compliant?

5) If a company were to give permission to use material for which that company does not have rights, does that mean that the permission is valid? Is it up to the product implementing said material to determine on it's own the legality of including such material?

6) Would I be mistaken in saying that as long as Wizards does not use OGC material they play by a different set of rules as the OGC publishers? If they do decide to include OGC content in a product they would have to make that product comply with the OGL? Would this be true even if a publisher gave WotC permission to include OGC in a closed product?

For example, if Publisher x released OGC y, WotC would have to release a product subject to the OGL if they included y in their product no matter what.

7) I would be interested to know if any publisher granted permission to a product publisher to use OGC material because they assumed that the product was OGL compliant, even if it wasn't. Can any publisher comment on that? (Note that this is not referring to PCGen per se. I see some other products that include OGC content from publishers.)

Follow up to that - if a non-compliant product includes OGC, can that damage the OGL itself? Clark discussed on another thread the dangers (to the secondary and tertiary publisher )of using secondary sources for a tertiary product, could this be along the same lines?

8) Question to the publishers - does WotC actually do any sort of compliancy certification for a given product?

If not, is it a double standard to expect such a thing for a software company?

Would WotC issuing a statement that says that software per se is not automatically non-compliant be sufficient, along with the standard protections afforded by the license, be sufficient for those of you hesitant to allow your material to be included in software?


Again, I certainly hold no animosity towards PCGen or any other product for that matter. I have seen several things bandied about and would like for some word from the important parties.
 
Last edited:

Legalese

I myself have wondered about some of these legal questions. It seems everybody is bandying about legal terms. I know nothing about the law. It would be nice to have it explained in layman's terms.

Mr. Peterson, you say your a lawyer. Can you explain/answer some of the previous questions in layman's terms. I'm not trying to be a smart ass here, I truely want to know.

For those of us here who know nothing about the law.
 

Status
Not open for further replies.
Remove ads

Top