Question on the proper use of polymorph

[Nebrok]

I an probable going to seem stupid for asking but I was to be absolutly sure on this.

Does a character's HD change when polymorphed? For instance, does a human who polymorphs into a bear gain a bears HD? If so are those HD rolled randomly or just given average rolls?

And in another instance, does a dragon with the alternate form ability retain it's dragon HD?

The question came up when I created a great worm gold dragon that has increadably high HP for a human in his alternate form.

 

[gabrion]

HD don't change, but an increase in CON score does give more HP. Don't feel like it's a dumb question cause lots of people have been confused about it.

 

[Iku Rex]

Does a character's HD change when polymorphed?

No.

Your class and level, hit points, alignment, base attack bonus, and base save bonuses all remain the same. -- polymorph, through alter self

(Note that gabrion is wrong about hit points changing when you polymorph - the above quote clearly states that "hit points remain the same". He may be thinking of a web article, polymorphing part 3, which says that hit points change if Con changes.)

And in another instance, does a dragon with the alternate form ability retain it's dragon HD?

Yes. It also retains its hit points, so the dragon's high Con will still give it extra hit points in human form. The polymorph rule quoted above is repeated in the alternate form description in the MM: The creature retains its hit points and save bonuses, although its save modifiers may change due to a change in ability scores. (This is confirmed in the web articles - polymorphing part 4.)

 

[gabrion]

No.

Your class and level, hit points, alignment, base attack bonus, and base save bonuses all remain the same. -- polymorph, through alter self

What spell does that quote come from? Hint...the answer is alter self. You will note that right before that, it also says that you retain your physical ability scores. However, the Polymorph spell is only similar to alter self in certain ways and keeping HP is not one of them.

The actual bits of relevant text are:

The subject gains the Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores of the new form...

and

If a character’s Constitution score changes enough to alter his or her Constitution modifier, the character’s hit points also increase or decrease accordingly.

'nuff said.

 

[Nebrok]

Thanx for the help.

 

[Mavrik]

Are you ignoring the fact that all the monsters in monster manual who get a con bonus from a change shape or polymorph do not get a HP bonus based upon their new CON bonus

I think the HP bonus on con is when you character has a perm increase as per the text above it no the line you chose.


SRD
You apply your character’s Constitution modifier to:

Each roll of a Hit Die (though a penalty can never drop a result below 1—that is, a character always gains at least 1 hit point each time he or she advances in level).
Fortitude saving throws, for resisting poison and similar threats.
Concentration checks. Concentration is a skill, important to spellcasters, that has Constitution as its key ability.
If a character’s Constitution score changes enough to alter his or her Constitution modifier, the character’s hit points also increase or decrease accordingly.

 

[Pinotage]

You might also want to take a look at the Rules of the Game articles on polymorph on the WotC website.

Rules of the Game Archive

I believe that the no added hp from change in Con was errata'd. If you Con changes, so do your hp, if the modifier changes.

Pinotage

 

[Lord Pendragon]

I believe that the no added hp from change in Con was errata'd. If you Con changes, so do your hp, if the modifier changes.

"Errata'd" as in, added to the errata for the PH? Or "errata'd" as in, mentioned in the RotG article you linked to? It should be noted that the RotG are not official errata in any way, shape, or form.

 

[glass]

What spell does that quote come from? Hint...the answer is alter self. You will note that right before that, it also says that you retain your physical ability scores. However, the Polymorph spell is only similar to alter self in certain ways and keeping HP is not one of them.

Keeping your ability scores is specifically overridden in Polymorph, as you point out. Keeping your hit points is not overridden, and so still applies.


glass.

 

[Pinotage]

"Errata'd" as in, added to the errata for the PH? Or "errata'd" as in, mentioned in the RotG article you linked to? It should be noted that the RotG are not official errata in any way, shape, or form.

May not be, but it makes a lot more sense than changing Con and not changing hp. Call it a house rule, if you want, but it's consistent with the core rules. Not changing hp and changing Con is not.

Pinotage