Ranged and sustain
- Thread starter vhailor
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DracoSuave
First Post
PHB said:
Here ya go.
AngryPurpleCyclops
First Post
can you sustain it if you can't see it?
not sure if there's a ruling on this but since the spell is ranged 10 if I'm adjacent to a creature and I use my std to make an attack on a creature we play I prompt an OA.
What about cover? a creature has partial cover from a corner with regard to the caster. The sphere is not attacking from the same angle so is not impeded by the corner does the target get cover? We play no but I could see an argument for either.
Can you move it if you can't see it? You're in a 5' corridor and want to back up 3 squares west then 3 squares south around a corner. The sphere starts 10' to your east. Can you now use a second move action to bring the sphere with you? i.e. the sphere moves 5 west and 1 south and ends 10' north of you?
not sure if there's a ruling on this but since the spell is ranged 10 if I'm adjacent to a creature and I use my std to make an attack on a creature we play I prompt an OA.
What about cover? a creature has partial cover from a corner with regard to the caster. The sphere is not attacking from the same angle so is not impeded by the corner does the target get cover? We play no but I could see an argument for either.
Can you move it if you can't see it? You're in a 5' corridor and want to back up 3 squares west then 3 squares south around a corner. The sphere starts 10' to your east. Can you now use a second move action to bring the sphere with you? i.e. the sphere moves 5 west and 1 south and ends 10' north of you?
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DracoSuave
First Post
Yes. Line of Sight is not necessary.
I believe that is correct. It is an attack, using a ranged power. So it is a ranged attack.
The point of origin for all ranged powers is the user of that power. Therefore, yes, cover/line of sight/line of effect is considered from the point of view of the user.
As an aside, cover/concealment is why you bring Scorching Burst along for the ride.
Yes, so long as you don't move it out of range. Line of effect is not necessary to sustain effects. However, you cannot use it to attack something you don't have line of effect to.
AngryPurpleCyclops
First Post
Scorching burst is a ranged power. The point of origin is the burst zone. The sphere is not attacking through cover so it makes very little sense to grant cover. Concealment might make more sense since the view is obstructed, you might miss. There is absolutely no chance that the corner interfere's with the attack in the case I outlined above. In my mind I treat cover as being like armor "it actually intervenes between the attacker and the target by blocking an attack". Sphere's attack is coming from the location of the sphere with regard to cover.
By your explanation if you had a (T)arget, (S)phere, and (W)izard in the following squares with | being a wall, the sphere could attack.
S | T
..W
I think it makes a lot more sense to take the point of origin as the sphere but grant concealment if something blocks line of sight to the sphere or target.
Is there a ruling on this somewhere?
MyISPHatesENWorld
First Post
This is what I got from a literal reading of the rules and application of the various sections regarding line of sight, line of effect and reading a power...sorry for the lack of better reference, but I don't have my notes for this with me. I looked all over for a CS ruling and found a bunch, but they were contradictory on pretty much evey point.
1) The creation of the sphere and attacking with the sphere require line of effect. (the Line of Effect page in the PHB)
2) Sustaining the sphere and moving it do not require line of effect. (Nothing in the books say those actions do.)
3) Using the power to create the sphere initially and attacking with it are use of a ranged power and making a ranged attack so you take OAs. (The opportunity attack page in the PHB).
4) Sustaining the sphere and moving it do not provoke OAs. (Nothing in the book says it does.)
5) You do not need line of sight to create, attack with, move or sustain the sphere (The line of sight page in the PHB for the first two and no mention of such a requirement for sustaining or moving).
6) You attack with the sphere, so penalties for attacking with the sphere are based upon your view of the target (You need line of effect to make a ranged attack. You make another attack with the sphere as a standard action for follow up).
The wording of the power in the initial effect can be an issue (and the sphere attacks) but it doesn't specify that anything about the power changes in regard to acting as a ranged power because of that wording.
1) The creation of the sphere and attacking with the sphere require line of effect. (the Line of Effect page in the PHB)
2) Sustaining the sphere and moving it do not require line of effect. (Nothing in the books say those actions do.)
3) Using the power to create the sphere initially and attacking with it are use of a ranged power and making a ranged attack so you take OAs. (The opportunity attack page in the PHB).
4) Sustaining the sphere and moving it do not provoke OAs. (Nothing in the book says it does.)
5) You do not need line of sight to create, attack with, move or sustain the sphere (The line of sight page in the PHB for the first two and no mention of such a requirement for sustaining or moving).
6) You attack with the sphere, so penalties for attacking with the sphere are based upon your view of the target (You need line of effect to make a ranged attack. You make another attack with the sphere as a standard action for follow up).
The wording of the power in the initial effect can be an issue (and the sphere attacks) but it doesn't specify that anything about the power changes in regard to acting as a ranged power because of that wording.
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