Ranged Attack Hitting Your Buddy

[Ascii King]

I can't find any rules that explain why you hit your friend with a ranged attack against an opponent in melee with your friend. I'm not used to the 3.5 rules yet. I have the PHB and of course the core rules, but the only thing I can find is the -4 penalty. It doesn't say anything about hitting your friends.

Is this a house rule?

 

[Hypersmurf]

In 3E, there were rules for "Striking Cover instead of a missed target".

In 3.5, the same rules can be found as a variant option (not the default rules) in the DMG.

-Hyp.

 

[Ascii King]

I don't have the DMG yet. Is there a link to this rule I can look at or could you break it down for me? Just the basics.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Note that this only applies to cover, which is entirely separate from the -4 penalty for shooting a target engaged in melee.

Here is the 3E rule, which I believe is pretty similar to the 3.5 optional variant.

Striking the Cover Instead of a Missed Target

If it ever becomes important to know whether the cover was actually struck by an incoming attack that misses the intended target, the DM should determine if the attack roll would have hit the protected target without the cover. If the attack roll falls within a range low enough to miss the target with cover but high enough to strike the target if there had been no cover, the object used for cover was struck. This can be particularly important to know in cases where a character uses another character as cover. In such a case, if the cover is struck and the attack roll exceeds the AC of the covering character, the covering character takes the damage intended for the target.

If the covering character has a Dexterity bonus to AC or a dodge bonus, and this bonus keeps the covering character from being hit, then the original target is hit instead. The covering character has dodged out of the way and didn't provide cover after all. A covering character can choose not to apply his Dexterity bonus to AC and/or his dodge bonus, if his intent is to try to take the damage in order to keep the covered character from being hit.

-Hyp.

 

[ARandomGod]

I can't find any rules that explain why you hit your friend with a ranged attack against an opponent in melee with your friend. I'm not used to the 3.5 rules yet. I have the PHB and of course the core rules, but the only thing I can find is the -4 penalty. It doesn't say anything about hitting your friends.

Is this a house rule?

That sounds like a house rule... as I understand it that is the reason for the -4 penalty, taking it garuntees you will not hit an ally. If you do not take it (and it IS optional) there is a 50% chance that you will hit an ally who is in melee combat with your intended target (Or, really ANYone who's in melee combat. But sometimes you don't care. Of course, times when two enemies are fighting each other aren't generally the best times to be shooting at them.)

 

[Hypersmurf]

That sounds like a house rule... as I understand it that is the reason for the -4 penalty, taking it garuntees you will not hit an ally. If you do not take it (and it IS optional) there is a 50% chance that you will hit an ally who is in melee combat with your intended target (Or, really ANYone who's in melee combat. But sometimes you don't care. Of course, times when two enemies are fighting each other aren't generally the best times to be shooting at them.)

Actually, it's not listed as optional... and neither is there any mention of a chance of hitting the wrong creature.

"Shooting or Throwing into a Melee: If you shoot or throw a ranged weapon at a target engaged in melee with a friendly character, you take a –4 penalty on your attack roll. "

If you shoot a ranged weapon at a target engaged in melee with an unfriendly character, there's no penalty... but neither is there a chance to hit the wrong one.

Whether or not you can declare someone from your own party "not a friendly character" just before shooting gets into the whole "What is an enemy/ally?" mess.

-Hyp.

 

[Alchemist]

I don't have the DMG yet. Is there a link to this rule I can look at or could you break it down for me? Just the basics.

As an off topic FYI, most of the important bits of the 3 core books are available in the SRD. I suggest http://www.systemreferencedocuments.org/35/sovelior_sage/home.html

 

[Hypersmurf]

As an off topic FYI, most of the important bits of the 3 core books are available in the SRD.

Of course, variant rules don't count as 'important bits'

-Hyp.

 

[cordell]

In our group, this was one of the most confusing things for people when we changed from 2nd edition to 3rd.

If you notice, in 3rd edition, *generally*, there are a lot fewer possibilties to kill your own party members. I suspect this was done for a reason by the game's designers. It's just not too heroic to die from an accidental arrow shot from your own party member.

The -4 penalty to hit applies only when you are attacking something in melee with a friendly creature.

The -4 penalty is *not* optional.

There is never a chance to accidentally hit your friend, unless you are using a variant/house rule of some sort. (Hmm...maybe you can hit him accidentally if your friend is grappling...i forget the grappling rules)

 

[Ascii King]

Thanks, guys. And Alchemist, I appreciate the link to the SRD. Unfortunately, ranged attacks aren't even really discussed in that document.

So, I'm assuming that this is just a house rule my guys use. What's the normal ruling everyone uses if you want to allow your players to accidently hit your buddy with a ranged weapon while in melee? Do you just use that cover rule that says if you would have hit him if it wasn't for the cover, you hit the cover?

My guys seem to have some rule that says even if you make a successful attack, you still have a 25% chance of nailing your friend. That seems ridiculous to me. Does anyone else use this rule? Where does it come from?