D&D 5E Re-opening discussion on multiple spell concentration.

[CapnZapp]

Cont'd:

I prefer to see the glass as half-full rather than half-empty = the current rather severe limitations on spellcasters in general and high-level wizards in particular affords several opportunities to have genuinely thankful players

That is, instead of taking abilities like the following for granted, and grumbling when they are denied them.... we can have actually grateful players when they discover that they can gain these abilities...!

I strong feel "archmages" should be able to gain some or all of the following:

... metamagic
... multi concentration
... voiding other limitations

At the absolute minimum, all of these should be epic boons. But that's really scraping the bottom, and I would not be opposed to the game adding something like an Archmage prestige class which you could take as early as level ~13 or thereabouts, which looks something like this...

Five level prestige class
1. - (you just study for no immediate benefit)
2. Expertise in Arcana
3. Minor arcane secret
4. Minor arcane secret
5. Major arcane secret

You keep your spell progression (gaining spells), at all five levels.
You gain no new hit dice in this class, at any level.
Minor secret could be something involving a 1st level spell: ability to cast it at will, ability to concentrate on both that spell and another concentration spell, limited metamagic (perhaps "choose two metamagic options and gain 3 sorcer pts")
Major secret is hitting the gold mine, the reason you skip five hit dice (even if they're d6es).

If you absolutely insist Wizards should be nothing special, feel free to allow "any spellcaster capable of casting a level 7 spell" to enter this class. Myself, however, I have zero problems with at the very least setting a multiclass ability requirement of Intelligence, if I won't just go ahead and tell it how it is: "a wizard capable of casting a level 7 spell".

Note: since you need five levels, you can't pick every secret there is. Not unless you enter the class two or five times

Remember, this is (at least for me*) a 95% NPC class, so it doesn't really matter what the entry reqs are for PCs.

*) My two 5th ed campaigns so far have ended at approx levels 9 and 16, and my current one (Tomb of Annihilation) will likely not break that.

 

[MarkB]

SNIP

That's all very nice, but at this point you're just straight-up threadjacking.

 

[Ilbranteloth]

I allow it, as a feat.

Divided Attention
You can attempt to cast a second spell that requires concentration, while you are already concentrating on a spell.
The spells must both be of 3rd level or lower.
You must make a Concentration check to cast the second spell. The DC is 10 + the combined spell level of the two spells.
Failure indicates you cannot cast the second spell while maintaining concentration. You can choose to maintain the existing spell, or cast the new spell.

Overall I don't see it as all that different than using a magic item that does the same thing (like several potions).

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Most of these suggestions seem destined to only incentivise spellcasters to become more buffbots and less active participants in a combat. If a spellcaster currently has two (or more) spell effects running that are benefiting the party, and taking damage means risking losing all of them, that's just more incentive to hide in a corner and concentrate on not drawing any fire. If multiple concentration makes it harder to succeed at concentration checks or imposes penalties to other checks, that's less incentive to get involved and try to contribute meaningfully to the battle.

I'd prefer the few suggestions that involve transferring the job of maintaining concentration away from the caster. Maybe have a feat or class feature that allows buff spells cast upon allies to be split into separate effects on each, with each character maintaining concentration on their own buff, and a failed concentration check only resulting in the loss of that buff for that one character. Maybe have a magic item (I'd make it a ring) which allows the wearer to take over maintaining concentration on a spell effect by touching a willing caster, leaving that caster free to cast another concentration spell.

This is one of the advantages of the Artificer Wizard Tradition, and to a lesser extent, the Artificer class: The ability to pass a buff to a party member that either doesn't require concentration, or allows them to concentrate on it.

The downside is something that highlights one of the primary reasons for concentration in the first place: Throttling use of spells rather than allowing greater novas.

 

[CapnZapp]

That's all very nice, but at this point you're just straight-up threadjacking.

Fair enuff

 

[Voromir]

I don't know if anyone has suggested this or not but I like the idea of your familiar being able to concentrate on a spell for you.
I think it would give them more flavor and usefulness as well as becoming a worthy target in combat.
They would have to make concentration checks just like the caster if they were concentrating on a spell for you.

Especially since find familiar is a ritual spell any class could get it with the ritual magic feat.

 

[Horwath]

I would like to be option to concentrate on multiple spells.

1. You can concentrate on number of "spell levels" equal to your proficiency bonus -1.

Concentrating on one spell only works as default.

 

[Voromir]

I don't think that will work as you'd never be able to concentrate on any spell higher than 5th level.
For example you'd never be able to cast Blindness/Deafness at 6th level to affect 5 people....
I think it would be better to say you can concentrate on a number of spells = to your proficiency bonus -1 or 1/2 your proficiency bonus rounded down?

 

[ro]

I don't think that will work as you'd never be able to concentrate on any spell higher than 5th level.
For example you'd never be able to cast Blindness/Deafness at 6th level to affect 5 people....
I think it would be better to say you can concentrate on a number of spells = to your proficiency bonus -1 or 1/2 your proficiency bonus rounded down?

I like this idea except that it allows a Champion Fighter 19 to take Wizard 1 at 20th level and instantly concentrate on three spells at once.

What about granting Concentration based on total spellcasting level, and losing only one at a time?

Concentration

When your total number of Spellcasting and Pact Magic class levels reaches 6th, you gain the ability to concentrate on two spells if exactly one of them targets you. At 14th, you gain the ability to concentrate on three spells if exactly one or two of them targets you. If you reach 20th in a single class you gain the ability to focus on any four spells. For example:
- A Ranger, who gains Spellcasting at 2nd level, would learn to concentrate on two spells starting at 7th level.
- A multiclassed Fighter 3 (Eldritch Knight) / Paladin 3 / Bard 3 / Warlock 8 would have 14 total Spellcasting and Pact Magic levels and be able to concentrate on 3 spells.

Taking Damage When you take damage while concentrating on multiple spells and are required to make a Constitution saving throw, you roll only for the highest level spell on which you are concentrating. If you succeed, you retain your concentration. If you fail, you lose concentration on that spell and then must roll for the next highest spell, continuing in this manner until you succeed or until you have no remaining concentration spells.​

I don't know if anyone has suggested this or not but I like the idea of your familiar being able to concentrate on a spell for you.
I think it would give them more flavor and usefulness as well as becoming a worthy target in combat.
They would have to make concentration checks just like the caster if they were concentrating on a spell for you.

Especially since find familiar is a ritual spell any class could get it with the ritual magic feat.

I like this, too. To combine it with the above, the familiar could give advantage.

Familiars and Animal Companions If you have a familiar or animal companion within 5 feet of you when you make a Constitution saving throw to retain concentration, it may use its reaction to give you advantage on the roll. If you would already have had advantage, you roll three d20's instead of two, and use the highest of the three rolls.​

 

[Voromir]

I like this idea except that it allows a Champion Fighter 19 to take Wizard 1 at 20th level and instantly concentrate on three spells at once.

At this point your level 20 and have only 2 spells per day so no concentrating on 3 , but I see your point. I was just trying to modify the previous posters idea.

As to only losing one spell at a time? I think it would bog down the game. It sucks but if you loose concentration you loose concentration. I think this could be a downside to concentrating on multiple spells at once.

I like your idea about total Caster Level instead of proficiency bonus.

I'd also like to throw in a caveat that you can't concentrate on the Same Name spell twice. For instance cast Fly on yourself and then use another 3rd level spell to cast Fly on someone else, while I don't really find that broken this is something you can do with a 4th level slot. This would prevent double stacking Haste or other silly combos.

Don't Rangers have 1/2 CL so they would gain dual concentration at 13th or 14th level? I haven't played Ranger/Paladin/Edritch Knight/Arcane Trickster to know if they'd really benefit from being able to concentrate on multiple spells, with the aforementioned caveat. So no 2x Hunters Marks going....

I don't have a problem with your animal companion helping out just like a familiar. I'd actually like to be able to cast a spell on your animal companion or familiar so it can function as both if you multi-class say Druid/Sorceror.

Also to keep game balance I think we need to find a way for non-spell casters to get an ability that would increase their abilities as well.