Realistic Combat that's Simple(ish)

Champions suffers from a number of problems when its wide scale gets narrowed down to “heroic” humans, whose stats really only have a few possible values: half-normal, normal, 1.5x-normal, or 2x-normal.

Simply dodging attacks should be exhausting for normal people.
Having been in more than my share of street fights and done a little amateur boxing, nope. Evading attacks is far easier and far less taxing physically than actually throwing punches, grappling & kicking.
If you’ve ever worn heavy gear, you can see that it doesn’t require some special skill proficiency, but it is exhausting and painful if you’re not used to it.

I have no trouble imagining that a wizard could wear heavy armor, but there’s no way he’d hike cross-country and climb down holes in it.
Actually, wearing armor affects your overall speed and coordination, so yeah, if "realism" is what we're after, there should be a level of skill incorporated into the proper use of armor.
 

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Having been in more than my share of street fights and done a little amateur boxing, nope. Evading attacks is far easier and far less taxing physically than actually throwing punches, grappling & kicking.
If you’re skilled, you can slip punches without much effort. If you’re not, and you’re not in fighting shape, it’s work — but it’s “free” in the Hero System.

Punching uses energy, kicking uses more, and grappling uses even more — until you’ve established dominant position.
Actually, wearing armor affects your overall speed and coordination, so yeah, if "realism" is what we're after, there should be a level of skill incorporated into the proper use of armor.
Getting used to wearing pads in football or hockey involved very little skill training but a fair amount of conditioning, mainly to get used to the extra heat.
 

Champions suffers from a number of problems when its wide scale gets narrowed down to “heroic” humans, whose stats really only have a few possible values: half-normal, normal, 1.5x-normal, or 2x-normal.

Simply dodging attacks should be exhausting for normal people.

If you’ve ever worn heavy gear, you can see that it doesn’t require some special skill proficiency, but it is exhausting and painful if you’re not used to it.

I have no trouble imagining that a wizard could wear heavy armor, but there’s no way he’d hike cross-country and climb down holes in it.

Those type of issues were what LTE was supposed to address, its just that for the most part people couldn't be bothered; even heroic scale games with Hero were normally used for high-cinematic settings and the like, and in most of those getting tired is only rarely presented as a big deal. That's even true for some that pay more attention to injury.
 

If you’re skilled, you can slip punches without much effort. If you’re not, and you’re not in fighting shape, it’s work — but it’s “free” in the Hero System.

Technically not in the latter versions. Its an END point a pop. Its just that normal people don't have a high enough SPD for that to be significant.

Punching uses energy, kicking uses more, and grappling uses even more — until you’ve established dominant position.

Getting used to wearing pads in football or hockey involved very little skill training but a fair amount of conditioning, mainly to get used to the extra heat.

I suspect that's a case of you using "skill" and "conditioning" in a way more distinct than the prior poster, or really I, would.
 

Rolemaster solved this circa 1980.

Both combatants have an Offensive Bonus (OB) resulting from their skill, strength, positional advantage, etc. At the start of the round each combatant decides how much of their OB they use to attack and how much they hold back as a Defensive Bonus (DB) that subtracts from incoming attacks.

Some editions have a similar decision point regarding Initiative where you can act quickly at -20, act normally at +0, or act slowly at +10.

When you attack someone you roll d100, add your OB and other bonuses, and subtract their DB and other penalties.

The real innovation is that you compare your result on a table. Each weapon has its own table (like broadswords and shortswords and scimitars and daggers are all different full-page tables). There are 20 Armour Types, from AT1 (nothing) tthrough leathers and chain to AT20 full plate. Each one is a separate column on the table. The results on the table determine whether it's a hit, how much hit point damage it causes, and what kind of critical table you roll on. Rolemaster characters generally have a lot more hit points and it's the critical hit tables that create the deaths and maimings.

What this means is that some armour types (like AT1) have more total misses (you are better able to dodge) but when you do get hit, it might be 20 hit points damage and a nasty crit. If you're in leather you are a bit easier to hit but the armour soaks up some of the damage so you lose less hit points and get reduced crit levels. If you're in chain or plate you are even easier to hit again but a lot more attacks that would have been nasty crits against AT1 are reduced to just hit point damage or lesser crit effects.

These tables are different for each weapon so slashing weapons might be even worse against plate while piercing weapons are even better against leather.

It seems very complex, and has a reputation for being complex, but as long as you can do a bit of addition I would say it's less complex than most modern editions of D&D. The tables do a lot of the heavy lifting.
Eh, I used to run a Rolemaster campaign. It’s a lot more complex than any version of D&D IMO.
 

On initial read I thought that with "steady pace of combat" Aramis was referring to its frequency/incidence rate. RPG characters tend to get in a LOT of fights, and this necessitates the odds of dying in one being relatively low if we're going to have ongoing character continuity.

Although now I could see an argument for it being about the pace of action in any given fight. In my own LARP and fencing experience, I do remember it being much more a mix of different paces- slower paced tentative feints and feeling each other out and pot-shotting punctuated by furious bursts of action where combatants are striking as fast as possible, trying to finish off an opponent, or overwhelm/push past them as part of a tactical maneuver*. And the latter are quickly tiring which enforces breaks/lulls again. Which is a significant contrast to a standard RPG combat round where each combatant tends to do the same amount of things each time they get to act.

Systems like Champions and Car Wars and Shadowrun having the faster combatants acting on more distributed segments each round is definitely a thing, but that's still a steady pace for them, as long as they maintain speed. As opposed to lulls and bursts for each combatant.

*(I often see this in realistic portrayals of modern combat too, for example WW2 stuff like Band of Brothers or SPR).
I was intending the pace of combat, not frequency.

Frequency is a good bit high, tho', too.
I feel like you have more to say about this.

Champions had an interesting mechanic for this. Each character had a speed stat, which determined how often you got to act. It was a bit clunky to consult the chart and confirm who got to act on each segment, but it meant that you didn’t cycle through everyone quite so predictably.
Champions suffers from steady pace of combat, too; it's phases chart by speed is NOT a solution to the even pacing of combat.

A more realistic approach, keep Speed... but roll (speed)d12 and go on the phases rolled. Tracking nightmare, but simple and far more realistic. In case of doubles, first unrolled slot after. So 3/3/6/7 goes on 3/4/6/7, and 3/3/4/4 goes on 3/4/5/6. ignore the chart.

If you really want to prevent simultinaity, use a french (bridge/poker) deck, dealing (speed) cards.

Either way, redo each round.

@thomas - LTE was a huge hassle for minimal gains in realism and story.

I've only had one game that had a decent lack of consistency... Prime Directive 1st ed. Due to the Action/Initiative rolls, one can wind up unable to act or only a small amount of action, but still be reasonably middle of the initiative count. Each die, after open-ending, is checked vs a tricode (base unarmored is 4/6/8), each die on 4-5 being 1 initiative, 6-7 being 2, 8-15 being 3, 16+ being 4 (optional rule); best die sets the level of action 4-5 being minimal, 6=7 moderate, 8-15 complete.
One fun case, the Security CPO had an A/I roll of 8d, and due to armor & encumbrance was 4/7/10... and rolled 8x 3's... one of a very few extreme rolls. Was a rough round... couldn't do anything but go prone... Following round, he had an initiative of 20 and Extreme level of action, whereupon he brought up the scatter phaser and dropped half the klingons.
Note that the open ending is 6 = 5+reroll; we counted the 6's, rolled a second batch, and it is recursive. The guy playing the CPO above once rolled a 56. That's 11 6's in a row, followed by a 1. His phaser pool was 10d. Only initiative uses every die, the rest just use the best.

PD1 isn't a fast system to resolve, but a roll sort mat helps immensely. And replicates nicely the "Riker &/or Redshirt stands there 2 seconds looking dumb before he dives for cover" effect.
 

A more realistic approach, keep Speed... but roll (speed)d12 and go on the phases rolled. Tracking nightmare, but simple and far more realistic. In case of doubles, first unrolled slot after. So 3/3/6/7 goes on 3/4/6/7, and 3/3/4/4 goes on 3/4/5/6. ignore the chart.

I was going to suggest something similar, but without the careful tracking. Just roll a d12 each segment to see if you get to go. (Or, since the game uses d6s, and most characters have a speed of six or less, just roll a d6.)

Champions was trying to model super-speed, so the model doesn’t work in realistic settings, where thinking clearly in the chaos of combat is tied to running faster, but we could fix that too, by divorcing movement rates from the segments in which you get to act.
 

I was going to suggest something similar, but without the careful tracking. Just roll a d12 each segment to see if you get to go. (Or, since the game uses d6s, and most characters have a speed of six or less, just roll a d6.)

That was occasionally suggested back in the day. Almost everyone hated it because of the potential for some characters to not get actions for an entire turn.

And of course in superheroic settings a 7 speed wasn't all that uncommon.
 

That was occasionally suggested back in the day. Almost everyone hated it because of the potential for some characters to not get actions for an entire turn.

And of course in superheroic settings a 7 speed wasn't all that uncommon.
In fantasy hero, I had one PC who was speed 8 (when the magic was on). I later restricted PCs to Speed 6, period. The cards approach works fine if ∑speeds ≤ 52 (french deck, no jokers). Above that, you need a second deck, or to include jokers for more than «shuffle the deck». Or to go to the larger decks, such as Tarot. (Tarot minor is 56, major is another 22, for 78, but no jokers; some have a normal-backed trademark, which is great as a reshuffle trigger.)
 

I was going to suggest something similar, but without the careful tracking. Just roll a d12 each segment to see if you get to go. (Or, since the game uses d6s, and most characters have a speed of six or less, just roll a d6.)
Which makes the game aspect complete fail - the even pace is for fairness. "So, Mrs. Lincoln, aside from that, how was the play?"
 

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