Pergentile
Explorer
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jdrakeh
Front Range Warlock
It has been better recently (I think because most of the threads have recently been occurring in the seldom visited Industry forum in the form of doomsaying threads speculating about the current state of WotC), but it still rears its head on the general forums every now and again - people posting just to say that x edition of D&D is not a "real" RPG (I.e., it's a board game/video game sim/war game), that y edition is superior/inferior to all others that came before/after it, etc. At times it absolutely dominates the forums.
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DumbPaladin
First Post
He has a point.
Well, [MENTION=13892]jdrakeh[/MENTION] has a point.
There are a few pretty common trolls on this forum, who post on a weekly (if not daily) basis and whose posts exist solely to trounce upon the opinions of others, and to fan their own narcissism and overinflated opinions of themselves. They are rude without reason and without remorse.
But I actually lay the blame for that at the feet of the moderators as a whole.
There's a two-tier system in place: longtime EN World users are regularly given carte blanche to troll, even to directly insult, but receive no public reprimand, or something amounting to a slap on the wrist. EN World users who have only been here 2 years or less, or who are simply less "known", can be instantly threadbanned, or worse, for similar behavior.
It's a double standard. I've seen it in action, and I've called a moderator on it. The response was something akin to "You don't know everything that goes on behind the scenes." True ... but what I do know is that the troll in question still behaves the way he has for years, and will continue to do so as long as he has the tacit approval of the moderator staff.
I also know if I behaved the way some longtime users have, I'd be gone. Thankfully, I was raised better. This in no way excuses the lack of policing upon these longtime EN World users, however.
The ignore list is a beautiful thing. There are 5 or 6 people that, were every reader to place them on an ignore list, would make EN World a more enjoyable place overnight.
But I can't credit a moderator staff with a "good job" when I've seen evidence of a disparity in the treatment of posters with similar behavior violations based upon what I can only assume is a length of time on here, or a bias in favor of those users.
So ... it's more a 2.5 / 5 for me. Most boards are something like 0.5 / 5.
Well, [MENTION=13892]jdrakeh[/MENTION] has a point.
There are a few pretty common trolls on this forum, who post on a weekly (if not daily) basis and whose posts exist solely to trounce upon the opinions of others, and to fan their own narcissism and overinflated opinions of themselves. They are rude without reason and without remorse.
But I actually lay the blame for that at the feet of the moderators as a whole.
There's a two-tier system in place: longtime EN World users are regularly given carte blanche to troll, even to directly insult, but receive no public reprimand, or something amounting to a slap on the wrist. EN World users who have only been here 2 years or less, or who are simply less "known", can be instantly threadbanned, or worse, for similar behavior.
It's a double standard. I've seen it in action, and I've called a moderator on it. The response was something akin to "You don't know everything that goes on behind the scenes." True ... but what I do know is that the troll in question still behaves the way he has for years, and will continue to do so as long as he has the tacit approval of the moderator staff.
I also know if I behaved the way some longtime users have, I'd be gone. Thankfully, I was raised better. This in no way excuses the lack of policing upon these longtime EN World users, however.
The ignore list is a beautiful thing. There are 5 or 6 people that, were every reader to place them on an ignore list, would make EN World a more enjoyable place overnight.
But I can't credit a moderator staff with a "good job" when I've seen evidence of a disparity in the treatment of posters with similar behavior violations based upon what I can only assume is a length of time on here, or a bias in favor of those users.
So ... it's more a 2.5 / 5 for me. Most boards are something like 0.5 / 5.
Dice4Hire
First Post
Well, if I saw troll-bait form someone with less than ten posts, I'd be pretty quick to jump on them, myself.
Why shouldn't the moderators take a different stance with people who have been here a while. Maybe the person gets angry, and posts something inappropriate, but have done many other posts in many situations that are perfectly fine. Taking that into account seems common sense.
But even if a person gets threadbanned (I have a few times) or given an involuntary vacation (not for me, yet) it is just a bump in the road. Calm down, modify your behavior a bit and move on.
But overall, if you find an old-time poster that annoys you to no end, just ignore them. I have a dozen people on my ignore list and it makes this site a lot nicer for me.
Why shouldn't the moderators take a different stance with people who have been here a while. Maybe the person gets angry, and posts something inappropriate, but have done many other posts in many situations that are perfectly fine. Taking that into account seems common sense.
But even if a person gets threadbanned (I have a few times) or given an involuntary vacation (not for me, yet) it is just a bump in the road. Calm down, modify your behavior a bit and move on.
But overall, if you find an old-time poster that annoys you to no end, just ignore them. I have a dozen people on my ignore list and it makes this site a lot nicer for me.
If you can find specific examples of what you mean, PM them to one of the moderators, and we'll take a look at them.
And I see it as an admission that we, as moderators, should jump to conclusions less readily than regular users. Your opinions on such matters apply to you, while ours end up applying to everyone. So, I don't see it as a bad thing that we are a bit conservative in our judgments.
Rel
Liquid Awesome
He's referring to the moderators as a group getting to play OD&D with Gary Gygax at GenCon several years ago. There's a link in my .sig describing the game.
As for the point that Dumb Paladin is asserting, we do take into consideration a posters history when moderating them. But, as far as I'm concerned, that works more against them than it does for them. If they have been around a long time then they've been around long enough to know better than to break the rules. I find myself cutting more slack to newer members who may have less of a grasp of the rules.
If you want a great example of this, perhaps you recall Shadzar. He was, in my humble moderatorial opinion, a real dick. And yet he posted here for quite some time, getting reported multiple times in numerous threads for generally being rude. We didn't boot him from ENW immediately. In fact the process was far slower than I'd have preferred precisely because we wanted to give him every opportunity to adjust his behavior before kicking him from the site.
Another member with very long standing (whose name I'll decline to mention) was recently permabanned for a single egregious infraction of the rules combined with creating an alt to circumvent the ban.
I'll say that we moderators are human and there are several of us so of course we're not going to be 100% consistent every time. But I put a great deal of stock in the good judgment of my fellow moderators and I find that we generally try to err on the side of being lenient.
jdrakeh
Front Range Warlock
Any examples that I am aware of at this point are outdated (as I mention, I've been primarily posting elsewhere for the last year or so), but I'll be sure to make a note of such instances going forward as I see them.
Someone just sent me a very civil PM on this topic, and it reminded me of a point that maybe we don't mention enough.
There is an inherent tendency for persistent negative stances to see moderator action. Here's why: If you are devoted to being "anti-X", then you are committed to saying negative things about X. Say negative things long enough, the chances are that you'll say something over-the-top negative, that gets you in trouble.
Concentrate on things that make you angry, and you'll act angry. No surprise there, right?
Concentrate on things that make you happy, and that effect goes away.
So, if you like a particular edition, or a particular company, stop trying to build it up by tearing the other one down! It is this activity, more than anything else, that gets people into trouble.
I will say again - I double-dog dare you to tell me what makes your game awesome, without comparing it to another system.
There is an inherent tendency for persistent negative stances to see moderator action. Here's why: If you are devoted to being "anti-X", then you are committed to saying negative things about X. Say negative things long enough, the chances are that you'll say something over-the-top negative, that gets you in trouble.
Concentrate on things that make you angry, and you'll act angry. No surprise there, right?
Concentrate on things that make you happy, and that effect goes away.
So, if you like a particular edition, or a particular company, stop trying to build it up by tearing the other one down! It is this activity, more than anything else, that gets people into trouble.
I will say again - I double-dog dare you to tell me what makes your game awesome, without comparing it to another system.
wedgeski
Adventurer
I would like exactly zero changes in ENW's moderation. In all the years I've been here my respect for the mods has only grown.
I've had the occasional gripe, sure. I also have a few posters that I would like to see moderated more than they are, but I also realise that perception bias plays a large part in that (i.e. they just rub me up the wrong way).
I've had the occasional gripe, sure. I also have a few posters that I would like to see moderated more than they are, but I also realise that perception bias plays a large part in that (i.e. they just rub me up the wrong way).
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