Redblade Character Generator Rocks

[Fast Learner]

Actually, my biggest beef with WotC is that they expect everyone else to play by their rules, but fail to do so themselves. E-tools doesn't have to play by the same rules that its competitors do because WotC made it. What makes it even more insulting is that even without the restrictions put on it by d20/OGL licensing it still isn't very good. WotC would have been better off buying out one of the independant generators (PCRec, Redblade, etc.) and giving it the official stamp. Hipocrocy does not beget respect.

Several others have noted that it's their property, of course they don't need to play by their own rules, and imo it's incredibly obvious.

In case it's not so obvious to you, imagine this: You write a song. You own it, and unless you give permission otherwise, only you can do anything with it (sell it, perform it, etc.).

Now you write up a special announcement that says "Other people can publish/perform/sell my song, as long as they put Thank you to linnorm for the use of this song on the item or say it before or after the song is performed.

Now you want to sell copies of your recorded song. Why in heaven's name would you need to put "Thank you to linnorm for the use of this song" on it? You own it! Your special announcement is about how other people can use it. It has nothing to do with you, and shouldn't.

There's nothing even faintly hypocritical about it.

 

[linnorm]

I've done a little research and must now concur that WotC is ok in using the IP (Intelectual Property) versions of the core books in E-Tools, as everyone else must use the SRD versions of the same. This does exempt them from the rules for the moment. However, I have noticed that some (SSS & Necromancer Games are the ones I noticed) game companies are contemplating allowing their material in E-Tools. If their material (which is OGL by force of the licenses) is included, doesn't the program have to conform as well? If E-Tools is noncompliant then it will be using the data in a noncompliant way, doesn't this violate the licenses? While the publishers may not have a problem with people using thier books with E-Tools, the licenses don't apply "only when we feel like it".

Fast Learner: You are correct, if the agreement says others who use it must have the thanks. If the agreement says that anyone who uses it must have the thanks, I would have to put the thanks in.

Linnorm

 

[MythosaAkira]

However, I have noticed that some (SSS & Necromancer Games are the ones I noticed) game companies are contemplating allowing their material in E-Tools. If their material (which is OGL by force of the licenses) is included, doesn't the program have to conform as well?

A company can do whatever it wants to with their Open Content if it is entirely original (that is, if it isn't derived from other Open Content). This includes using it in things that aren't open. The fact that it is open means other people can use it, but it doesn't restrict them from using it however they want, since they retain copyright regardless.

If the content is derivation of other Open Content, that's a different story.

 

[linnorm]

A company can do whatever it wants to with their Open Content if it is entirely original (that is, if it isn't derived from other Open Content). This includes using it in things that aren't open. The fact that it is open means other people can use it, but it doesn't restrict them from using it however they want, since they retain copyright regardless.

If the content is derivation of other Open Content, that's a different story.

Doesn't all OGL content derive from the SRD? To create the new wizard spell "Bob's Instant Pancake" doesn't mean much if you don't know what a wizard is.

Linnorm

 

[MythosaAkira]

Doesn't all OGL content derive from the SRD? To create the new wizard spell "Bob's Instant Pancake" doesn't mean much if you don't know what a wizard is.

As long as you declare something as "open" (in the context of the OGL), it's open - it doesn't have to derive from the SRD. It simply means that anyone else who abides by the OGL can use it. You still retain copyright (and must be credited in Section 15 of the license if someone else uses the material), so you can do whatever you want to with it.

Of course, you don't see a lot of this. Most people keep original material closed, and open only those things that must be open (things that derive from the SRD or other open content).

 

[hong]

Of course, you don't see a lot of this. Most people keep original material closed, and open only those things that must be open (things that derive from the SRD or other open content).

Everything on my D&D page is open....

 

[Fractalwave]

Everything on my D&D page is open....

Ok...cool. That's great. But now you need to tell us which is open and which is not. It's the "clearly marked" thing coming back to haunt you.

Your declaration on the website is saying "All original material on this page and on pages linked to it (other than off-site links) is released as Open Game Content under the OGL."

Ok, I've never read all the books. Which ones are original and which ones are not?

Sometimes people put that info in section 15 of the OGL that they distribute with it. But your section 15 on the site does not have that information in it.

Because of this, I'd say that it's not clearly marked.

Second problem is that you're using the d20 logo which implies you are following the d20stl. However, I do not see any of the required statements that the d20 guide outlines as required on all d20 products. You should go read the d20 guide or drop the logo from the website.

Oh, the answer to the obvious question is that yes websites are supposed to conform to the licenses they use as well. WotC has asked several websites to correct things. The first one that I heard about was asked to make corrections a year ago.

 

[Fractalwave]

However, I have noticed that some (SSS & Necromancer Games are the ones I noticed) game companies are contemplating allowing their material in E-Tools. If their material (which is OGL by force of the licenses) is included, doesn't the program have to conform as well? If E-Tools is noncompliant then it will be using the data in a noncompliant way, doesn't this violate the licenses? While the publishers may not have a problem with people using thier books with E-Tools, the licenses don't apply "only when we feel like it".

As I mentioned in one of my other posts that was probably too longwinded for some, nobody has to conform to the OGL under one condition...

If E-Tools enters in a separately negotiated licensed with the actual owner of the material that they wish to include, then the OGL does not apply.

In effect, it would be the E-Tools people negotiating with all the copyright holders for a particular book for the license/right to use their material. The problem with doing this is then you have to enter separate negotiations and agreements with all the different people for all the different books.

This is the one thing that the OGL does for you. You don't have to enter a bunch of different legal agreements and incur those costs to use material declared as open.

Does that mean that E-Tools folk won't do this? Nope. But in my opinion, unless the bulk of the book is NOT declared as OGC they'd be foolish to do so. It's a waste of money.

 

[hong]

Ok...cool. That's great. But now you need to tell us which is open and which is not. It's the "clearly marked" thing coming back to haunt you.

Everything. On the page. Is open. Is that clear enough, or should I be monosyllabic?

Ok, I've never read all the books. Which ones are original and which ones are not?

If you've never read the books, you're not interested in D&D, and therefore there's nothing on the site for you.

 

[Fractalwave]

If you've never read the books, you're not interested in D&D, and therefore there's nothing on the site for you.

Don't get snippy. I'm trying to be helpful. There's no cause for a statement like that on these forums. Posting my gameplay resume or my job resume is not a requirement for the use of these forums. If you have a problem with me then PM me or email me.

I was simply pointing out that not everybody owns or has read all the books that exist. So when you do this, you need to clearly mark the information. One reason for this is that the OGL itself is a viral entity and knowing the original source of all open material is important for publishers for legal reasons.

For more information on why, go check the OGF lists. You'll also find all sorts of debate about how you should "clearly mark" things.