D&D 5E Reducing Power Gaming

[The Soloist]

For 5e in 2018, before character creation, I stated no multi-classing and no feats. Everyone was on board with that. Worked fine for us.

 

[Thomas Shey]

I admit I personally would have a hard time dealing with players who outright can't accept true failure. My narration is based on what makes logical sense to me. If you roll badly (or what you attempted was unlikely to work anyway), then just having failed makes sense to me.

That's your choice, but I'm far more interested in managing the overall tone of the group than any personal need to present "logical sense" in combat systems that are usually abstract to various degrees. In particular in the D&D sphere I just can't be arsed to insist on picking out the result description that will demoralize someone when it makes no actual practical difference.

 

[Thomas Shey]

Hey, do whatever you want... and I'll do the same, thanks.

What, like I could change that? Doesn't stop me having an opinion about it.

 

[Thomas Shey]

What are the unnamed faces on an internet forum expected to do about the way your group treats you?

What can unnamed faces on the internet do about anything we talk about? This is as good a place to vent about it as any.

 

[Micah Sweet]

That's your choice, but I'm far more interested in managing the overall tone of the group than any personal need to present "logical sense" in combat systems that are usually abstract to various degrees. In particular in the D&D sphere I just can't be arsed to insist on picking out the result description that will demoralize someone when it makes no actual practical difference.

Way to present me as being awful.

 

[Guest 7037866]

Way to present me as being awful.

Yep, that was pretty much the tone I got from that poster concerning their replies to my own posts as well.

Guess we're just bad boys, huh?

 

[Guest 7037866]

What, like I could change that?

Because it builds character? (no pun intended)

Even professional athletes under ideal training conditions sometimes just miss a shot, a throw, or whatever. It happens. Perhaps they swung too hard or threw too hard, throwing off their aim? Sometimes, and they KNOW this, they just messed up and failed.

Sure, other times perhaps the grass was slick under foot. (The less comical and more practical approach to this is better--sure, don't "make fun" when it happens!) Or the wind kicked up and pushed their shot, etc. Or some other external factor was to blame for their failure.

In a game where there is opposition (such as D&D combat), then more often than not it is likely the enemy countered, dodged, took the hit but wasn't affected by it. So, active opposition is why they failed.

But to always play it off as "you didn't fail--they stopped you" card reinforces to players the "always have it your way" mentality. Yes, it's a game and we all there (hopefully!) to have fun, but frankly speaking D&D is a game which as taught me a LOT over the years about success, good planning, doing maths, etc. but also about FAILURE, lack of preparation, bad luck and when not to push it, etc.

I'm not telling you (or anyone) to be an asshat about it. But as I said upthread, learning to accept actual disappointment and dealing with it from time to time is a learning experience the game can teach as well. Sometimes (with such a game of dice) it is just bad luck, but sometimes playing it as "well, you missed, but as you keep adventuring your numbers improve and you will get better" or whatever is a good way to go, too.

It isn't about pessimism or anything like it. Sometimes bad things happen. Facing them is better than pretending they don't exist IMO.

Doesn't stop me having an opinion about it.

No, it doesn't. Obviously.

 

[Horwath]

FWIW many times it doesn't make narrative sense for the PC to actually "miss" their target, so in those cases I say they "hit but fail to affect the target" (a glancing blow or whatever that has no impact on the combat effectiveness---what HP really are).

Sometimes it's okay to say the PC just missed however. People should, IMO, be able to accept outright failure at times. We all fail---nothing wrong with that.

AC 10+dex+whatevery magical deflection is "miss" attack.
then you have 2+ AC for shield, when you block with a shield
above is a glance off armor.

I.E:

half plate with shield and +1 ring for AC

AC: 10+2+1+2+5, total 20

attack roll under 13(dex+ring) is complete miss,
roll 13&14 is deflected by shield,
roll 15-19 is glance of the armor.

OFC, it would be tiresome to remember all of those values, but it's an example how to describe a "miss".

 

[Bae'zel]

It isn't about pessimism or anything like it. Sometimes bad things happen. Facing them is better than pretending they don't exist IMO.

It’s all about the narrative framing by the DM. We all have different styles. I deleted my previous posts because this topic seems to strike a nerve. My experiences have been that there’s a popular GM style that consistently interprets failures as character incompetence, rather than bad luck or oppositional force or “oh well, you missed, moving on”. I explained that I can see why some players power game because such DMs can often feel antagonistic that way.

This isn’t necessarily about “over empowering the players” or “players are special snowflakes who can’t handle failure ever “. It’s about how we frame these events, contextualize them.

Some DM styles can intentionally or not, create the friction of player vs. DM. If that’s what you want, good for you. It’s just one possible reason why some players may want to powergame though.

 

[KYRON45]

What can unnamed faces on the internet do about anything we talk about? This is as good a place to vent about it as any.

We have to engage our problems was my point.
The OP was asking for ways to mitigate a problem. If people are power gaming and that's not your thing...say so.
If people are treating you in a way that you don't like...say so. But tell the offending parties don't just shout into the void about it. That's my advice about how to deal with aspects of your game that make you unhappy.