Reincarnate = immortality?

[Hypersmurf]

I'd have said that, strictly, reincarnate would take away the age mods to your mental scores, on account of you being a young adult now. There's no provision in the rules for separate ages of your body and soul.

Well, Reincarnate says "Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores depend partly on the new body", but says nothing about mental ability scores.

If you read it as you suggest, would that mean that if you are ever hit by a magical aging effect, it wouldn't affect when you die?

They removed all the magical aging effects from 3E, so the rules to cover them weren't necessary...

-Hyp.

 

[jaelis]

Well, Reincarnate says "Strength, Dexterity, and Constitution scores depend partly on the new body", but says nothing about mental ability scores.

One could argue that there's no need to call out changes in the age modifiers, since it already says you become a young adult. Would you say that any physical aging penalties that have accrued would still apply?

 

[Hypersmurf]

One could argue that there's no need to call out changes in the age modifiers, since it already says you become a young adult. Would you say that any physical aging penalties that have accrued would still apply?

I'd say no, because Str, Dex and Con scores depend partly on the new body. Since the body is young adult, the modifiers to Str, Dex, and Con should be those of a young adult.

Since your Int, Wis, and Cha scores do not depend partly on the new body, the modifiers to those should be unchanged.

-Hyp.

 

[D.Shaffer]

*shrug*
If they want to off themselves, take the level/con hit, and can pay the 1000 GP per hit, they can reincarnate as much as they want to, as far as I'm concerned. They just shouldnt be surprised when they come back as an Awakened Penguin.

 

[jaelis]

I'd say no, because Str, Dex and Con scores depend partly on the new body. Since the body is young adult, the modifiers to Str, Dex, and Con should be those of a young adult.

Guess I'm not buying it. Seems to me that "depends partly on the body" jsut means that you replace your original racial mods with the new form's, since that is what the ensuing description says. But its not like the description is real clear.

Would you apply the same logic consistently to other effects? Like inherent bonuses, or spell effects from things like feeblemind or bestow curse? (ie, mental score adjustments would remain, but physical score adjustments would not?)

 

[Hypersmurf]

Would you apply the same logic consistently to other effects? Like inherent bonuses, or spell effects from things like feeblemind or bestow curse? (ie, mental score adjustments would remain, but physical score adjustments would not?)

I'm not convinced that an inherent bonus to Str or a decrease in Str due to Bestow Curse are things that are 'attached' to the body rather than the soul...

... but it should be consistent with how one handles Magic Jar.

If I cast Fox's Cunning and Bull's Strength on myself, and then Magic Jar into your body, we know that I have my Int score and your Str score. But do I have your Str score, and a Bull's Str spell adding +4? Or is the Bull's Str spell still 'attached' to my body? Do I have my Int score, and a Fox's Cunning spell adding +4? Or is the Fox's Cunning still 'attached' to my body?

Same questions with inherent bonuses and curses - do they carry over with the soul, or remain with the body?

However it's handled for Magic Jar is how it should be handled with Resurrection.

-Hyp.

 

[prospero63]

*shrug*
If they want to off themselves, take the level/con hit, and can pay the 1000 GP per hit, they can reincarnate as much as they want to, as far as I'm concerned. They just shouldnt be surprised when they come back as an Awakened Penguin.

QFT.

 

[Nail]

Does this reset the aging clock?

Yup.

High level druids that are sufficiently clever might find a way to periodically renew themselves too.

 

[jaelis]

... but it should be consistent with how one handles Magic Jar.

I'm becoming convinced, since it would seem that by my reasoning, an old wizard who took over a young body using magic jar would lose his age adjustments, and I can't quite see that.

But it's not obvious how it works. One way you might approach it would be to say that effects taking a will save are tied to your soul, while effects with fort and refl saves are tied to your body.


Another point in your favor is the effect on aging of being on a timeless plane: even though your body doesn't age, the years catch up to you when you leave it. That suggests that aging, and presumably the age when you die, doesn't have anything to do with the physical aging of your body.

 

[Shin Okada]

I don't care much about this. There are ways to be immortal other than using reincarnate or being an undead (like green star adept). And there even be immortal PC race in Psionic Handbook.

And my players have never actually played the same character that long anyway.