Reincarnated as a Centaur - Doing it by the Book?

[Orco42]

Indeed. Thank god that spell doesn't exist, or it would be part of innumerable Smackdown! threads.

Well I haven't seen it in a smackdown so I think you are serious.

It is a spell in MotW.

 

[Stalker0]

Broken?! Are you completely insane?!

I don't know about you, but no sane player I know would risk drawing from a deck of many things, nor would they accept reincarnation.

hehe, my latest character drew from a deck of many things. I think it had some of the old 2e cards in there along with some DM favorites. Here's what happened:

1) blinded
2) lost a level/gained a level
3) -1 to all saves
4) Became the hated enemy of the azer nation
5) Gained a +3 vorpal/ shocking/keen greataxe (and I'm a bard)
6) Fought death (and not teh ty 3e death, the man himself) and died.

Yeah, those things aren't nice

 

[Zerovoid]

Under the standard DnD rules, no centaurs exist that do not have the 4 centaur hit dice. I would give the player all the benefits of being a centaur, and also the centaur ECL. When he has enough experience to gain a level with the ECL factored in, then the character levels up as normal. This long delay can be justified as "getting used to the new body" or something.

Just because you take a wacky road to get to some type of character, in this case centaur, doesn't mean you can get stuff for free.

 

[fuindordm]

Wolverine stronger than bear??!!

Holy... Wow, my next monk is going to get find some high level druid and save a rain forest for him or something so that he'll kill me and True Reincarnate me over and over again until I end up as a wolverine with +10 str, +8 dex, and +8 con unnamed to add to my monkish powers.

Rawr! Ph34r the overgrown badger!

This has gotta be an oversight on someone's part. How does this follow from the Wolverine's base stats:

Str 14, Dex 15, Con 19

Shouldn't it be Str +4 Dex +4 Con +8?

Maybe they meant to say "Whale".

15th level rogue gets reincarnated as whale... passes time sneak attacking passing ships.

--Ben

 

[Sigma]

Under the standard DnD rules, no centaurs exist that do not have the 4 centaur hit dice. I would give the player all the benefits of being a centaur, and also the centaur ECL. When he has enough experience to gain a level with the ECL factored in, then the character levels up as normal. This long delay can be justified as "getting used to the new body" or something.

Just because you take a wacky road to get to some type of character, in this case centaur, doesn't mean you can get stuff for free.

Well, the 'standard D&D rules' for the reincarnation spell have been posted already on this thread, and they do not make any mention of additional hit dice being awarded for reincarnation. And, the closest thing to an ECL is only vaguely outlined in the DMG. Now, if you could either quote the SRD or give me a page reference which says 'no centaurs exist that do not have the 4 centaur hit dice', that would be helpful.

 

[Jeremy]

Re: Wolverine stronger than bear??!!

This has gotta be an oversight on someone's part. How does this follow from the Wolverine's base stats:

Str 14, Dex 15, Con 19

Shouldn't it be Str +4 Dex +4 Con +8?

Maybe they meant to say "Whale".

15th level rogue gets reincarnated as whale... passes time sneak attacking passing ships.

--Ben

Perfect!

Wait, damn. Objects, immune to sneak attacks.

How about a barbarian whale with rage and sunder?

 

[Zerovoid]

Well, the 'standard D&D rules' for the reincarnation spell have been posted already on this thread, and they do not make any mention of additional hit dice being awarded for reincarnation. And, the closest thing to an ECL is only vaguely outlined in the DMG. Now, if you could either quote the SRD or give me a page reference which says 'no centaurs exist that do not have the 4 centaur hit dice', that would be helpful.

Well, I could quote the DMG rules in the section Monsters As Races. These rules tell you how to create a centaur character. It seems to me that a centaur is a centaur, and it doesn't matter if you start out as one, or become one due to reincarnation. Anyway, that is how I would rule it in my game.

The spell description posted above incudes:

The reincarnated character does gain any powers or abilities associated with his new form, including forms of movement and speeds, natural armor, natural attacks, etc.

I would consider the 4 hit dice to fall into that category, since all centuars have them, simply because they are big and burly centaurs.

Anyway, you can interpret the spell either way. I played in a game that used your interpretation. I brought the issue up, but the DM said he would rather just use the stat modifiers so the character didn't need an ECL. Since the character was a wizard, the +8 to Str wasn't really unbalanced.

 

[Sigma]

Well, I could quote the DMG rules in the section Monsters As Races. These rules tell you how to create a centaur character. It seems to me that a centaur is a centaur, and it doesn't matter if you start out as one, or become one due to reincarnation. Anyway, that is how I would rule it in my game.

The spell description posted above incudes:

The reincarnated character does gain any powers or abilities associated with his new form, including forms of movement and speeds, natural armor, natural attacks, etc.

I would consider the 4 hit dice to fall into that category, since all centuars have them, simply because they are big and burly centaurs.

Anyway, you can interpret the spell either way. I played in a game that used your interpretation. I brought the issue up, but the DM said he would rather just use the stat modifiers so the character didn't need an ECL. Since the character was a wizard, the +8 to Str wasn't really unbalanced.

So, if a wizard were to polymorph into a centaur, would he get the 4 extra hit dice? If he was human, and he polymorphs into an elf, does he get an extra hit die? What about the mysterious sentence in the middle of the middle of reincarnation that states that the hit points of the creature remain unchanged? Wouldn't the addition of mulitple hit dice invalidate that?

The rules in the DMG are for making a new character. The rules in the phb under polymorph, reincarnate, and the druid's shapechange ability (which you may note, also does not add hit dice) govern what happens when your shape changes through other means. They make no mention whatsoever of additional hit dice because it doesn't happen. It's not an interpertation, it's not a house rule, it's in black and white in the text.

Sheesh.

 

[mikebr99]

Broken?! Are you completely insane?!

We are talking about random chance here, yes? Besides, if the sorcerer in question was reincarnated as a Leopard or Wolvorine, sure he would get some hellacious stat bonuses but be unable to cast spells. Depending on how many levels of Sorcerer you have under your belt already, this could seriously cripple the character. Not to mention the other more subtle disadvantages. Sure, Reincarnation could potentially make someone more powerfull in the stat arena, but it could just as easily put an end to their adventuring career as well.

You did read the part in the spell where it says the new animal form can speak all of the languages already known, and is a magical beast? You are saying that the badger can speak, but not cast spells?

 

[Negative Zero]

i dunno if this has been adressed yet (haven't read the entire thread) but ...

... So, now the character can continue in his class, he's got a lot better movement, a +8 to Str, +2 to Dex (net, he had +2 before as an elf, but lost it per Reincarnation) ...

why is it a net bonus? why does the character "lose" an attribute bonus at reincarnation? are all races considered to be human under it all?

~NegZ