Retroactive Barbarian Variant

Rae ArdGaoth

Visitor
As I've mentioned in the General Discussion thread, I recently went over the Barbarian Totem variants in detail and noticed that the Horse Totem fits my dwarven barbarian Rasereit perfectly. His only friend for many years was a horse, Ride is his only maxed out skill, and he has always had a horse at his side. He also seems to end up running around the place lot.

The abilities being replaced would be Uncanny Dodge and Trap Sense (Though he's L6, he's only Brb 4, so no Improved Uncanny yet). Trap Sense he's never used, and I can't honestly remember a time where Uncanny Dodge was used. He has nearly died twice, once on the Island of Varras'zul against a swarm of invincible demon bugs, and once in Niobe's Dilemma against a group of 5 criminals. Neither time did he benefit from Uncanny Dodge.

I'm willing to spend DM credits on this change, if that's desired. I think an appropriate amount would be equal to the XP spent in a Psychic Reformation. Since Razh is L6, he'd need 300 XP for himself + 300 XP for the manifester, so 2 DM credits.
 

Bront

The man with the probe
I'd rather you just get a Psychic Reformation (It would cost him money to find someone to do it too). But I have no problem if you do that. It'd just cost the equivilent of a 4th level power manifested by a 7th level caster with no XP if you spend the extra credit, though you might need to find someone to do it.
 

Trouvere

Visitor
Does the change necessarily have to be retroactive? He's currently by default a jaguar totem barbarian. The RAW says "The choice of a totem must be taken at 1st level, and cannot be changed later except under extreme circumstances (such as the barbarian being adopted by another tribe)."

Throw some extreme circumstances at him, Manzanita!
 

orsal

LEW Judge
Trouvere said:
Does the change necessarily have to be retroactive? He's currently by default a jaguar totem barbarian. The RAW says "The choice of a totem must be taken at 1st level, and cannot be changed later except under extreme circumstances (such as the barbarian being adopted by another tribe)."

Throw some extreme circumstances at him, Manzanita!
Does the lack of options available at the time the character was created constitute an extreme circumstance?
 

Rae ArdGaoth

Visitor
The example given by the rules is the barbarian being adopted by another tribe. Rasereit probably started out as a Jaguar Totem barbarian, then he left home and met his horse friend, and then he got to level 2. That second level would surely have been taken in Horse Totem barbarian, had the variant been approved.

It's still a retroactive change, though, and a year after the variant was approved. Interestingly, I was the one who pointed out that Wyrmslayer's initial proposal was incorrectly copied, and I copied the correct variants over from the SRD. :eek:

Probably my thought process was this: Hm, totem barbarians, these look neat. Oh, horse totem! What, no fast movement +10'? That's dumb, no thanks. Wait, that's wrong, wait, a bunch of these are wrong. I'll fix them. Now what was I thinking about before this? Oh well.

The totems were approved with the allowance of current barbarians to change retroactively, and Rasereit has yet to gain a level in barbarian since the totems were approved... ;)
 

Bront

The man with the probe
That's a different issue then. I didn't realize we made an allowance to change retroactively in the proposal.
 

Rae ArdGaoth

Visitor
Sorry, I didn't mean to be unclear. I said Rasereit hasn't taken any levels in barbarian, but what I meant to say was "Rasereit has taken levels in fighter, but not any in barbarian."
 

Erekose13

Visitor
ao'Thuir retroactively changed to one of these after his adventure had concluded. It was allowed then, though he has since retired without adventuring again so it never really came up.
 

Rae ArdGaoth

Visitor
So, we have a consensus? Should I request 3 official judge votes, or does this fall under the retroactive change provision of the totem proposal?
 

orsal

LEW Judge
Rae ArdGaoth said:
So, we have a consensus? Should I request 3 official judge votes, or does this fall under the retroactive change provision of the totem proposal?
I found the original totem barbarian proposal thread. As you see, it wasn't exactly clear on what rules we were establishing for retconning. Some voters referred specifically to changing "before the next level-up" (a boat which Rasereit has already missed) while others more generally just spoke of allowing existing barbarians to adopt a totem. So, to eliminate any possible uncertainty, I suggest (and hereby demonstrate by example) being absolutely unequivocally explicit by voting Yes to allowing Rasereit to adopt a totem now.
 

B4cchus

Visitor
Although I think it is a little bit late, there are no mayor implications because of the change. I agree with Orsal and also vote YES to allow Rasereit to adopt a totem now.
 

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