Ring of Sustenance and Growing Up

[domino]

Of course, if the baby is up for so long, then that means that it gives the people on watch something to do. You could train the baby in various things, while you're on watch. Person goes to sleep, next person wakes up, watches and plays with the kid.

 

[Queen_Dopplepopolis]

The group has discussed the whole sleeping thing when we thought the ring would be a possibility - there's a whole section of discussion about it on our hosted forum (before the DM officially ruled)... it would be very interesting to see how a child like that would grow up.

 

[Jack Simth]

Although I believe the ring would fully sustain an infant (or a 40 ton dragon for that matter) I believe you've all missed the really interesting aspect of a baby wearing a ring of sustenance: what would a baby who only sleeps 2 hours a day be like? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK a newborn baby sleeps an average of 20+ hours a day; it's part of its normal development cycle. But the ring's bearer only requires 2 hours of rest a day which means the baby is awake and aware about 500% more of the time. Asside from perhaps driving its guardians insane with it's constant need for attention, I believe the child would also learn it's basic skills at an accelerated rate. As I understand it, the first five years of a child's life is the time it develops the most in its entire life. Such young children learn to crawl, walk, talk, run and learn a thousand other things they'll need to know throughout their lives. They absorb new experiences like sponges. A baby that's learning 5 times as often would probably develop somewhat more quickly; at least within the bounds of it's physical and cerebral limits. I'd expect it to start babling and crawling sooner, start interacting with its environment more and to eventually walk and talk much sooner than expected. Such a child would probably grow up to be very curious and precocious. Just my two cents though.

Just to be nit-picky, but an infant who would otherwise sleep for 20 hours a day would not sleep for 2 hours a day, but for 5 - the ring reduces an 8 hour rest to a 2 hour rest - a ratio of 4 -> 1; so 20 hours would go to 5, 24 would go to 6. The little tyke gets to sleep through the first watch or two, and stay up all day (or sleep for two hours, be up for 6, sleep for 2 hours, be up for 6.....).

 

[reanjr]

It seems to me that if it stopped maturation of the child, it would stop aging. I'm not an expert on the topic (especially since magic is in the equation), but it seems to me that if a child's aging processes were not halted, yet they had deficiencies in whatever they need to age (proteins, lipids, etc.) but the child was kept magically alive anyway, that child would become deformed in some tragic way. This sounds great for Ravenloft...

 

[ARandomGod]

Damn if Rings of Sustenance worked that way I wouldn't have to be seriously considering Lichdom for one of my characters

Just what I was thinking!

Why not try Murlynd's Spoon? It basically makes pablum for PCs, so why not babies?

Seriously, the act of feeding an infant is a means to effect an emotional bond. Slapping a ring on it instead of feeding it is the equivalent of turning it over to a 'wire mother' --- you'll end up with a psycho monkey on your hands.

Or a PC. Same thing.

Not as long as you cuddle it and play with it, etcetera.

I run the ring in a similar manner, the wearer does not suffer numeric penaties and damage from hunger thirst and lack if sleep. Hunger and thirst still gnaws at you and you'd kill for a nap, but thats as bad as it gets, unless the ring come off....

See, now an interesting house rule. Mean, sure. But interesting. Of course, even that still provides actual sustenance.

I myself say the kid would grow up on the small side with a -2 or -4 to STR and CON, but the way your dm runs it sounds fine to me.

That would be even MORE mean. I'd have the kid grow up not understanding 'hunger'. Immune to feeling it, or something. Used to it.

You could also get him the ioun stone tha sustains without air, tie him up and toss him in a bag of holding if your PC wants to bypass parenting.

No, THAT would give you the wire baby syndrome.

I recommend just asking for a few years downtime, have the father talk with is other family members and when the child can be kept with an uncle or such do so.

Perhaps the father should do the responcible thing and retire from his hazardous line of work?

Now you're just talking crazy talk. How is it responsible to quit your job, and leave the world to be taken over by daemons and undead? Then not only would you no longer be able to afford even the ring of sustenance, or food for yourself, but your baby would grow into a world of pure evil!

I think that will be my next character

Ha! Proof that you're evil.
I love it.
Think your GM will let you start with the ring of sustenance and necklace of adaptation? I mean, for the story...

I don't think there is a 'correct' ruling here.

But I think the DM is brilliant. It sounds like a fun challenge. It's his job to put challenges in front of you, and to tell you when you solved them. In his mind you haven't solved this challenge yet. I wouldn't argue the point, its one of those things that could really go either way.

Or there could be a third way - maybe the child does grow, but there are consequences. For instance, the magic might change him physically somehow. Or scar him emotionally from lack of contact. It's fun to think about.

And while I think that RAW, yes, that would indeed solve the problem, I have to agree with this too.

Although I believe the ring would fully sustain an infant (or a 40 ton dragon for that matter) I believe you've all missed the really interesting aspect of a baby wearing a ring of sustenance: what would a baby who only sleeps 2 hours a day be like? Please correct me if I'm wrong, but AFAIK a newborn baby sleeps an average of 20+ hours a day; it's part of its normal development cycle. But the ring's bearer only requires 2 hours of rest a day which means the baby is awake and aware about 500% more of the time. Asside from perhaps driving its guardians insane with it's constant need for attention, I believe the child would also learn it's basic skills at an accelerated rate. As I understand it, the first five years of a child's life is the time it develops the most in its entire life. Such young children learn to crawl, walk, talk, run and learn a thousand other things they'll need to know throughout their lives. They absorb new experiences like sponges. A baby that's learning 5 times as often would probably develop somewhat more quickly; at least within the bounds of it's physical and cerebral limits. I'd expect it to start babling and crawling sooner, start interacting with its environment more and to eventually walk and talk much sooner than expected. Such a child would probably grow up to be very curious and precocious. Just my two cents though.

Oooh! That's where all those "spellcasting prodigy" characters come from!

 

[Sarellion]

Leave the child with a trusted ally and hide it in secrecy. I know a good line for the father when he meets his son.

"I am your father, Luke!"

 

[Bastoche]

I would pick up the leadership feat and have some sort of adventuring nurse as a cohort.

 

[Storm Raven]

I don't think the semantics favor one way or the other. As storm raven notes, the primary and secondary definitions go either way.

Of course, that assumes that you can divine whether the desiners intended "sustaining" to be interpreted ridiculously narrowly or not. You haven't given any indication why they would have chosen your extremely limited and rarely used definition for the word.

Since the designers clearly didn't include this dilemma in the specific item description, I chose the definition that seemed most consistent with what the ring seems to do.

The fact of the matter is that we don't know *how* the ring works (it doesn't say). In my game, it would not work (because of my understanding of the semantics) to keep an infant alive, except as a short-term emergency measure (it can be a bottle, but not a mother), because of my linguistic understanding of what sustenance means (which, of course, may be a primary or secondary definition). Once the baby were to pass out of infancy, it would become a more realistic option (as would simple cow's milk) because the physiological needs of a growing child are less unique (and less severely different from) an adult's, which is who the ring (in my world) is designed to sustain.

Except that your definition does run counter to how the ring works. Your definition would not allow for a person wearing the ring to recover from wounds, ability damage, poison, disease, or other debilitating conditions, since it would not provide the nutrition necessary to do anything other than "sustain" the wearer's body. Unless you make that ruling as well, which doesn't seem to be indicated anywhere in the description (and one would expect something as critical for adventurers as that to be specifically mentioned if it were true), then your "baby" ruling makes no sense and is directly counter to how the ring works.

 

[Roman]

I think a ring of sustenance could be a valid way to take care of the child-feeding problem for one reason - raising children might not be the aspect of the game that the players in question want to spend a great deal of time concentrating on. In fact, in such a situation I would not even require a ring of sustenance and simply assume that they take proper care of their child.

If the players find the concept of raising children in game fun, though, than it is a very different matter. Although I would still rule that the ring of sustenance provides all the necessary food and water, a child reared on such an item would have severe psychological problems on a number of accounts later in life:- food, drink, sleep issues, etc.

 

[Queen_Dopplepopolis]

I think a ring of sustenance could be a valid way to take care of the child-feeding problem for one reason - raising children might not be the aspect of the game that the players in question want to spend a great deal of time concentrating on. In fact, in such a situation I would not even require a ring of sustenance and simply assume that they take proper care of their child.

If the players find the concept of raising children in game fun, though, than it is a very different matter. Although I would still rule that the ring of sustenance provides all the necessary food and water, a child reared on such an item would have severe psychological problems on a number of accounts later in life:- food, drink, sleep issues, etc.

I think this would be vaild if the child were somewhat older - or, at least, that is the DMs reasoning... but - the child is essentially getting handed over to Daddy the second it is born... so, there needs to be a challenge raising the child, at least somewhat.

I, however, am not really looking forward to the drastic changes that having the child adventuring with us is going to bring... but - we'll find a way to make it work (I hope).