Ring of Sustenance and Spellcaster's rest

Legildur · Apr 4, 2003

I can't find any references, but I was positive that a Ring of Sustenance did NOT reduce the required rest time (from 8 hours to 2 hours) for spellcasters to recover spells.

Help!!! I've checked the SRD and FAQ.

Cheiromancer · Apr 4, 2003

Check under "Preparing Wizard Spells" on page 154 of the player's handbook. Sorcerers and Bards refer to this section:

"To prepare her daily spells, a wizard must have a clear mind. To clear her mind, the wizard must first sleep for 8 hours.... If the character does not need to sleep for some reason, she still must have 8 hours of restful calm before preparing any spells. For example, elven wizards need 8 hours of rest to clear their minds, even though they need only 4 hours of trance to refresh their bodies....)

Antikinesis · Apr 4, 2003

This has been the subject of considerable debate.

By the letter of the rules, the ring provides the benefits of 8 hours of sleep in two hours. This is not trumped by "If the character does not need to sleep...", because the character does still need to sleep. They just get all the benefits that sleep provides in less time than they would without the ring.
[Edit] I'd like to add, with a tip of the hat to Caliban, IMHO. [/Edit]

However, spellcasters all have a maximum number of spells that they can cast in a day. This limits the abuse that can be accomplished with a Ring of Sustenance.

It does open more questions, though... how long is a day? When can a caster learn more spells? Is it fixed at the same time each day? etc.

[Edit]
IMC, spellcasters with RoS's aren't allowed to exceed twice their daily spell limits for any one-day period of time. E.g., go a day without casting any spells, cast all their spells at 1:00, sleep 2 hours, prepare all their spells again, cast them all at 5:00... and now they can't cast any more spells until after 1:00 the next day. This way, you can always mark off a timeline where their spells didn't exceed daily limits, even if they bunch around the border between days. And, yes, it does get messy sometimes.
[/Edit]

-AK

Caliban · Apr 4, 2003

Antikinesis said:
This has been the subject of considerable debate.

By the letter of the rules, the ring provides the benefits of 8 hours of sleep in two hours. This is not trumped by "If the character does not need to sleep...", because the character does still need to sleep. They just get all the benefits that sleep provides in less time than they would without the ring.

In your opinion it is not trumped by that. Several people, including myself, are of the opinion that it is.

Antikinesis · Apr 4, 2003

Caliban said:
In your opinion it is not trumped by that. Several people, including myself, are of the opinion that it is.

Okay, fine. I'll grant you an IMHO.

In my defense: the ring's description doesn't say "... to gain the benefit of 8 hours of sleep, except for wizards and other spellcasters." The ring provides the same benefit that sleep does, be it "restful calm", or a "clear mind". This is not eliminating the "need to sleep", just getting it done (and meeting the spellcaster's rest requirements) in less time.

IMO, of course.

-AK

melkoriii · Apr 4, 2003

Antikinesis said:
Okay, fine. I'll grant you an IMHO.

In my defense: the ring's description doesn't say "... to gain the benefit of 8 hours of sleep, except for wizards and other spellcasters." The ring provides the same benefit that sleep does, be it "restful calm", or a "clear mind". This is not eliminating the "need to sleep", just getting it done (and meeting the spellcaster's rest requirements) in less time.

IMO, of course.

-AK

You do make a good point. THe way it is worded it would be that way.

For game ballence reasons I will say you still need 8 hours.

LokiDR · Apr 4, 2003

How much does the ring cost? Do you really think the designers mean spellcasters to get extra spells? The only arguement is semantics, which is a pretty weak arguement.

drnuncheon · Apr 4, 2003

LokiDR said:
How much does the ring cost? Do you really think the designers mean spellcasters to get extra spells? The only arguement is semantics, which is a pretty weak arguement.

Of course, if the ring does not actually provide extra spells - if the benefit of it, in other words, is that you need only take 3 hours to prepare your spells each day instead of 9 - then is there a problem?

Only if you allow wizards to gain extra spells/day by sleeping in the middle of the day is Antikinesis' interpretation of the ring problematic.

J

LokiDR · Apr 4, 2003

drnuncheon said:
Of course, if the ring does not actually provide extra spells - if the benefit of it, in other words, is that you need only take 3 hours to prepare your spells each day instead of 9 - then is there a problem?

Only if you allow wizards to gain extra spells/day by sleeping in the middle of the day is Antikinesis' interpretation of the ring problematic.

J

The only qualification on a wizard re-memorizing his spell list is rest. He already can do it twice in a day. Wizard != Cleric.

Antikinesis · Apr 4, 2003

LokiDR said:
How much does the ring cost? Do you really think the designers mean spellcasters to get extra spells? The only arguement is semantics, which is a pretty weak arguement.

1. Couple grand.

2. No. It has no effect on spells per day.

3. Can you point out any arguments on this board that aren't about "semantics"?

-AK