Ripple Effect of D&D's Statement on the Rest of the RPG Industry?

[Bluenose]

Tolkienesque fantasy is inherently reactionary, which makes it hard to present it in a liberal or egalitarian vein.

If you wanted to play up Tolkein from a more liberal perspective, you'd want to emphasise the destructive "industrial" wastelands that Saruman in Orthanc and Sauron in Mordor have created. Industrialised environmental destruction and warfare against more environmentally friendly lands - elves living with nature, Rohirrim herding horses across their plains, and the Shire's peacefulness and plenty. Anti-industrialisation/anti-capitalism can be a conservative viewpoint (although it's rare), but I don't think it's reactionary in most senses of the word.

 

[Lem23]

What do you mean remove racism from them? Lovecraft's bigoted views were part of what influenced him and it's too late to change that now. But it's easy enough to run CoC adventures that don't include depicting anyone who isn't a white Anglo Saxon as a degenerate.

The new version of Masks of Nyarlathotep is great in this regard. The enhanced sections on New York (in Harlem in particular) stand out as being well-thought out concerning the racism of the period, and the designer notes that talk about how the campaign as a whole came about from having read a biography of Jomo Kenyatta help place context too. There have been other tweaks made here and there, and it's still not perfect, but it's a good exampe of taking some really horribly racist material and inverting it, in a similar way to Matt Ruff's Lovecraft Country.

 

[aramis erak]

WotC using the term "Race" in 5E is going to have secondary effect on a number of publishers...

I don't think it's going to make much difference for Wizards bottom line (Magic is the main one).

THe only reason it's going to have a noticeable effect is WotC is the 800# gorilla...

One thing that may backfire is that things like the vistani as portrayed: Sure, they're based upon popular imagery of the "Gypsy"... Largely a negative stereotype... which is based upon the Romany, but largely isn't accurate. The two Romany I've known have both enjoyed the presentations for oWoD and Ravenloft. One, in fact, liked WoD: Gypsies so much, he bought me a copy so he could play one in my game.

I do wonder if it's a case of "Since Group A hates being used, Groups B, C, D ... Z must hate it, too" without asking B, C, D, etc...

WotC is trailing Paizo on this.

Technically, so are you... (notes thread about better terms to use).

Also, in ACE:
[q="ACE Playest 1.1"]

• Dwarf. Grumpy, and with a Scottish accent (if you want), you can appraise the value of things with a single glance.
• Elf. You’re very sneaky, and when in natural surroundings, you can be effectively invisible.

[/q]
Elf isn't horrible, but the "Dwarves are Scots" trope is pretty much a reductionist trope.
You did call them species, tho', so you're not too far behind...

I don't think most fantasy games will walk away from the term. Most SciFi will use species as they long have...

Industrial inertia is a powerful factor.

 

[Morrus]

Technically, so are you... (notes thread about better terms to use).

Yep. I certainly am. It applies to me equally. But the thread isn't entitled "Ripple Effect of Morrus' Statement on the Rest of the RPG Industry?" In no way am I an industry leader.

Elf isn't horrible, but the "Dwarves are Scots" trope is pretty much a reductionist trope.

That's satire.

 

[aramis erak]

That's satire.

Satire in text is often easily misconstrued.

I, for one, find the scots dwarves motif rather tired... not offensive, just overused. So I completely missed that it might have been an attempt at satire.

 

[Morrus]

Satire in text is often easily misconstrued.

Satire was the province of text long before the internet existed, and my game is very much a comedic, satirical game which plays on tropes.m in the vein of 2000AD comic books, Douglas Adams, or Terry Pratchett.

I, for one, find the scots dwarves motif rather tired... not offensive, just overused. So I completely missed that it might have been an attempt at satire.

That was -- exactly - the joke. The trope is overused.

I mean, if you want to playtest my game and leave feedback that the jokes weren't good enough, that's cool. But this isn't the place for it -- let's stay on topic: the industry leader changing their use of the word 'Race".

 

[MGibster]

Satire has been the province of text long before the internet existed, and my game is very much satirical game. Don't ever read the 2000AD comic books if satire in text is a problem for you.

Wait, Judge Dredd isn't meant to be interpreted in a straightforward manner?

 

[Campbell]

Wait, Judge Dredd isn't meant to be interpreted in a straightforward manner?

There seem to be a host of people that are uncritical fans of stuff meant to be taken critically. See also The Punisher, Tyler Durden in Fight Club, Joel in The Last of Us, Dexter, Walter White in Breaking Bad, Jax in Sons of Anarchy, etc.

 

[MGibster]

There seem to be a host of people that are uncritical fans of stuff meant to be taken critically. See also The Punisher, Tyler Durden in Fight Club, Joel in The Last of Us, Dexter, Walter White in Breaking Bad, Jax in Sons of Anarchy, etc.

Hell, even Dredd's questioned the system at times.

 

[Ralif Redhammer]

Also, Verhoeven's films.

There seem to be a host of people that are uncritical fans of stuff meant to be taken critically. See also The Punisher, Tyler Durden in Fight Club, Joel in The Last of Us, Dexter, Walter White in Breaking Bad, Jax in Sons of Anarchy, etc.