[RttToEE] Don't let undead take the first watch

[DM with a vengence]

My PCs are currently going through RttToEE and I’m afraid that I might have no chance but to kill them all.

They are currently in the Moathouse Dungeon, where they’ve cleared out the top row of rooms, killing skeletons, gnolls, and one Cleric. The problem is they decided to sleep for a night in room 28; the diamond shaped one with the 6 gnolls, leaving their 3 commanded ghouls as guards.

During the night, Garrick the gnoll ranger realizes all his gnolls are and finds the party in the room, he contacts the clerics, who take the ghast from area 31 and go to room 27, where they then command the ghouls. (They have a pretty good chance to get at least on of them. The ghast and ghouls paralyze the party while they sleep, the ranger trusses everybody up, and they all get dragged off into area 22, where they are then tortured for all their information before being killed.

Meanwhile, the one member of the party not in the Moathouse is on his way all alone to Nulb, where he’ll run into something he can handle, and get killed. Since he’s a cleric, I could have him receive a vision from his goddess telling him to go to the Moathouse, but I don’t like that idea and he’ll get killed by the 3 ghouls, the ghast, the gnoll ranger and the two clerics before he can move.

Should they magically be spared, or should I kill everyone and say we should do a new quest. Advice and suggestions appreciated.

 

[Vaxalon]

Have them get rescued by another party of adventurers. A more competent party of adventurers. A *good* party of adventurers who includes a paladin.

Have them ask how they got in this predicament. If they mention commanding the ghouls, have the paladin arrest the perpetrator for necromancy. Do whatever you can to get them to play HEROES ferpeetsaek.

I *can't stand* people who want to play evil parties, I really can't.

 

[CWD]

Have them get rescued by another party of adventurers. A more competent party of adventurers. A *good* party of adventurers who includes a paladin.

Have them ask how they got in this predicament. If they mention commanding the ghouls, have the paladin arrest the perpetrator for necromancy. Do whatever you can to get them to play HEROES ferpeetsaek.

I *can't stand* people who want to play evil parties, I really can't.

Hey, you can play a neutral cleric of a neutral or evil god and still be able to command undead!

 

[Lazybones]

Relying on commanded undead as guards in a place where evil clerics have already been battled? Sleeping in a partially cleared dungeon with no precautions?

What, do they leave their treasure at the local thieves' guild for safekeeping as well?

Good or evil, players need to be confronted with the consequences of their actions.

My 2c.

 

[Barendd Nobeard]

Should they magically be spared, or should I kill everyone and say we should do a new quest. Advice and suggestions appreciated.

Kill 'em off. Anything else is too cheesy.

 

[Pielorinho]

During the night, Garrick the gnoll ranger realizes all his gnolls are and finds the party in the room, he contacts the clerics, who take the ghast from area 31 and go to room 27, where they then command the ghouls.

Give the party a listen check to hear the command happening. I'd make it pretty easy: they're sleeping in an area silent as a tomb, and then an evil cleric calls out to the nearby undead to obey his commands.

Of course, this assumes that you've not already played through this scene; am I right?

If you're feeling really merciful, tell the players that the stench of the room is too great, and they're unable to sleep deeply there. No regaining spells, but also no surprise round when the cleric approaches.

If the ghouls attack the party, have them stop when the first party member is down, coup de grace that member, and begin eating. That should give the rest of the party a round in which to say, "Oh my god!" and flee for their lives.

If they don't do that, then you'll be in trouble. You may have to kill the party off. Just do it in a really gruesome and terrible fashion, full of bones cracked open and marrow sucked and paralyzed victims being torn apart by squabbling ghouls. Then have them create new characters and go in after the first, late and lamented party.

Total party kills are generally to be avoided, I think -- but if you give them several chances to avoid total destruction and they refuse to choose life, then you owe it to them to make their deaths as lurid and horrible and cool as you can.

Daniel

 

[Crothian]

Don't just kill them because of pooor planning. Give them a chance, then kill them. Have them get listen checks and see what happens.

 

[Hammerhead]

TRY CANDYLAND

Haven't they ever heard of spiking themselves in a room? Or setting guards other than ravenous, man-eating ghouls? This is sad and pathetic. My advice: quit running RttToEE and start them on something a little easier, like Candyland.

And why the hell did they split up? To "cover more ground?"

Unfortunately, despite these player's idiocies, I feel your actions were, or at least seem to be the way you described them, unfair. I find it difficult to believe that a cleric could command undead without waking the party up. Or that they could all be paralyzed without saving throws.

However, if these players simply had a momentarily brain lapse and are not total newbies as they appear, I wouldn't kill them. And rescues are cheesy. Divine-inspired visions to save the party are cheesy. Instead, give them a chance to escape.

DOn't leave the door open, though. If they're too dumb, kill them. But if they are ingenious and clever, grabbing weapons and blinding opponents with open salt shakers, in a true Bondish fashion, why not?

 

[WanderingMonster]

Now or later..what's the difference?

RT3OE2 is so difficult that you can spare them now and let them kill themselves later. They'll even think you were being kind.

 

[Damror]

I'm playing RttToEE right now too. We've finished the moathouse and moved on to Nulb.

Persoanlly, I think your players need to learn fom their mistakes so far. So killing one or two might be a good idea. They need to think twice before they do things. If they don't, they get killed. That is how the game is played.

I see the game as an exercise in problem solving. If my party makes bad decisions, I expect someone to die. Even when we make good decisions we die sometimes.

Although I do not disagree with playing evil characters (I've done it myself a few times), I would suggest playing good characters in RttToEE. We have a paladin who helps out a lot.

In my opinion, they should not have slept in the moathouse in the first place. They should also not let the undead watch by themselves (as you mentioned).

I also think that they should have had a chance to hear the evil cleric's command. I ran an encounter a few months ago where the players had several animal companions. They got attacked by a NPC who took control of their animals while they slept in a very similar way as you did with your characters here. That encounter was the last one of my campaign and it killed all but one of the players. I didn't think twice about it because I felt that they made a mistake in leaving the animals on watch when they knew there was an enemy in the area who could control animals. I did, however, allow them a chance to hear the command that took control of the animals.

So, I think the same holds true for your party. Like I said earlier, I'd make sure they paid for their mistakes. How much they pay is up to you.

Here's another idea:
If they are being tortured, and they are already evil, it wont be hard for the NPCs to convince the PCs to join them. Even if they are not evil, this could happen. Read about the stockholm effect, to lean how this works.
[shameless plug] there is also rules for torture and the stockholm effect in the Primal Codex, available from RPGnow.com [/shameless plug]

So, if I were you, I would make them pay, then either let some (most?) of them live and effect a dareing escape. Or, I would try to turn them to the villain's side (note, as a player in RttToEE I don't know if that is really a good idea or not).

As for the guy who is on his way to Nulb by himself, he needs to turn around or he'll be killed. My party was almost killed last night in Nulb. We tried to run away until we realized the monsters were faster than us. So, we had to resort to some pretty daring heroics. Right now, my character has a total of -10 Strength penalty. And we were only in Nulb for about 5 minutes.

Also, even if you do kill them all, you don't have to start a new quest. You can start RttToEE again, this time with paladins and good clerics. Or even pick up where your party has left off with new characters.

You could even mix those ideas and have the current PCs become NPCs in the service of the villains and have the players start new characters. Or, invert it, and have them keep playing the bad guys and you can bring in a party of paladins and clerics as NPC heroes who start pursuing the adventure.

You might also talk with your players a little about what they would like to see happen.

That's my essay on the subject, anyway...