Samloyal23
Adventurer
Are there any rules out there for using torture to gain information or reprogram a berk's mind? I'm thinking some telepathic effects could be simulated through applied psychological abuse...
Rules for Torture/Brainwashing?
- Thread starter Samloyal23
- Start date
Grogg of the North
Adventurer
Book of Vile Darkness has rules on torture but IIRC it only gives you bonuses on intimidate checks.
You could use spells like Programmed Amnesia or Mind Rape to rebuild someone's mind. Modify Memory would do it too but it only gets you 5 minutes worth of time. You could probably use Programmed Amnesia to set a trigger phrase similar to Bioshock. Now, would you kindly....
You could use spells like Programmed Amnesia or Mind Rape to rebuild someone's mind. Modify Memory would do it too but it only gets you 5 minutes worth of time. You could probably use Programmed Amnesia to set a trigger phrase similar to Bioshock. Now, would you kindly....
Samloyal23
Adventurer
I am thinking there needs to be some skills involved in interrogation techniques and psychological manipulation so that no supernatural effects are needed. Obviously magic and psionics can rip the truth out of someone and control behaviour. Magic can even alter alignment. But that would be too easy...
Samloyal23
Adventurer
Not if it is going to have substantive, crunchy effects on the game. If you can program someone through coercion to behave as though under a geas or charm effect, then some dice need to be involved.
Samloyal23
Adventurer
I am thinking that a torture skill would be similar to a craft, with different types of results obtainable after a certain period of time with a high enough DC roll. So, you could do something simple, like inducing fear or something complex like changing a victim's alignment. Something extremely complex, like inducing a specific type of insanity or creating a new personality, would require a master level torturer multiple checks over a prolonged period of time...
I think Dordledum made a good point, I would just like to add to this, time is needed as well.
But sometimes not even that is enough to break a person, see: The skin I live in (A good move for torture and brainwashing inspiration).
Crimson Contracts (which I believe you can find in the ENWorld store) has some pretty good rules on Torture. It's a PDF and I remember testing the rules out a bit and finding them pretty representative.
Torture doesn't really allow you to just reprogram your target. For that I would probably use torture, make them fear the blade, then use Geas. It's a dirty trick, and it will probably kill whoever you place it on if they don't get healing, but using it in combination with planting a scrying (you'll have their blood and flesh) you can have a sorcerer torturer quite easily gain a lot of information from their target.
Of course that's the magical side of things... But it would be a lot more useful to you than most effects... In theory you could also make a knife that allowed the user to Dominate his target by carving them up long enough... But that again is strictly magic.
Physical torture is only one option. Psychological interrogation, deprivation, etc. should work beside that... Someone who has to deal with a inconsistent variable series of noises, lights, food/water deprivation, etc. can give you just as much information as putting knife to flesh. You'll break the target more than likely, but what's a little insanity?
Slainte,
-Loonook.
Torture doesn't really allow you to just reprogram your target. For that I would probably use torture, make them fear the blade, then use Geas. It's a dirty trick, and it will probably kill whoever you place it on if they don't get healing, but using it in combination with planting a scrying (you'll have their blood and flesh) you can have a sorcerer torturer quite easily gain a lot of information from their target.
Of course that's the magical side of things... But it would be a lot more useful to you than most effects... In theory you could also make a knife that allowed the user to Dominate his target by carving them up long enough... But that again is strictly magic.
Physical torture is only one option. Psychological interrogation, deprivation, etc. should work beside that... Someone who has to deal with a inconsistent variable series of noises, lights, food/water deprivation, etc. can give you just as much information as putting knife to flesh. You'll break the target more than likely, but what's a little insanity?
Slainte,
-Loonook.
Samloyal23
Adventurer
Magic is cheating, you can do anything with magic. What would interest me is determining the mix of physical and psychological techniques required to create specific mental conditions. How long does it take to break someone down enough to make them change alignment? Can you brainwash a paladin to make him assassinate your enemy for you? How do you de-program someone who has been brainwashed?
Weeks? Months? Years?
I mean, to change someone's outlook look at boot camp/military training. You push someone through sleep deprivation, sensory deprivation, chemical attack, combat, assaults on the body and mind to temper the person into a more effective combatant. It doesn't always work, and that's something that is mostly voluntary (you can wash out if you so desire or can't hack it).
Stretching the human mind via psychotropics, social engineering, etc. helped to produce the Manson Family. The mind is meant to accept a large amount of bull before it breaks... If it is kept in peak condition. There are POWs who never break, people who cannot withstand torture at all and break at the threat of it... It's such a crap shoot.
And we have no evidence of an actual Manchurian Candidate. There have been several alleged projects from multiple governments around the world trying to do what you're talking about... Zilch. Mostly we wound up with a lot of self-defenestration, PTSD, etc. from alleged attempts. The mind... Doesn't work in an easily programmable form.
Slainte,
-Loonook.
