D&D 4E Running Dark Sun and 4e for the first time

Thyrkill

Explorer
So I've decided to take the plunge into 4e and run a game of Dark Sun. I have avoided 4e until recently, having been enticed back by Essentials, and I want to see how 4e actually plays (I was a 3.5 DM who refused to make the jump to 4e, but have realized recently that I should probably play/run the game and let my biases go).

My question to the community at large is this: Can Dark Sun be run with just Essentials (I understand that there are no rules for psionics), or should it be played using the Core material? Following up on that, if Essentials does work what do I do about the psionics? And, if the Core is the way to go, what books do I need, since I am completely new to the whole 4e world?

Thanks in advance for all your help,
Matt
 

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OnlineDM

Adventurer
My take on it is that you can use Dark Sun as fluff with no problem. If you want to rule that a Mage can actually be a "Psionic Mage," that's fine. Follow the Mage rules as written and just rule that it isn't arcane, it's psionic. Done.

Is there really any difference between the arcane, divine, primal and psionic power sources aside from flavor? Not really.

If you like the Essentials stuff and you like the Dark Sun setting, I think you can absolutely run a fun Dark Sun game with just the Essentials classes.
 

Riastlin

First Post
I'll echo OnlineDM's sentiments. You can run the game with any combination of core and essentials. As he said, technically mages are frowned upon in Dark Sun, but there's no reason why you couldn't call it psionic just without the power points. Or, the mage character(s) could be among the brave few who try to wield the magic, perhaps in hopes of becoming a mage-lord (or whatever they are called). Could actually make for some fun roleplaying as the mage would try to be discreet in his actions.

As for what you should get, it really depends upon your budget.

Naturally the Dark Sun campaign guide is a good start and you'd probably want to pick up the creature catalog as well. After that you could either a) pick up a Monster Manual(s) or just get a DDI subscription for the Monster Builder.

Other books worth checking out would be the two DMGs, though much of the information if the first DMG would be out of date, particularly in an Essentials/Dark Sun game given the changes in magic item distribution. I highly recommend the Rules Compendium as it has all the up to date rules and can actually take the place of the PHB and/or HotFL to an extent.

Personally, I am a collector to an extent so I like picking up the PHBs, etc. but really only the players would need those. If you have the compendium you don't need either the PHB or HOTFL in order to run the game, so in the end it just comes down to how much money you want to spend. I usually suggest start small in case you don't like the rule set. Obviously the best edition of the game is the one with which you have the most fun -- meaning everybody's different thus nobody is right and nobody is wrong.
 


Pseudopsyche

First Post
I would be tempted just to use Essentials, assuming none of the players feels a strong need to have psionics. Why not let the mage be arcane and explore the social consequences throughout the campaign? The biggest limitation is that the only leader (healer) class would be the druid, assuming you remove the divine classes as suggested. One possible solution, if no one wants to play a druid but you want a healer, is to use Essentials plus just PHB 3, for the new psionic classes, including the ardent (psionic leader).
 


I confess I'm not too familiar with Dark Sun, but I thought a couple of the major city-states were ruled by Mage-Kings or something like that. Obviously I could be wrong, and would greatly appreciate any corrections. :p

Sorcerer-kings. (Probably should be wizard kings since 3.x.) They're all powerful wizard/psions.

On Athas, arcane magic relies on plant energy for use. There are two ways of casting arcane spells. The default is defiling (in flavor terms; in rules terms the default is preserving. Confused yet?).

Defiling simply drains all plant life energy within a certain radius to power a spell. It's hideously wasteful. A lot of wizards (or I guess now warlocks) can't or won't be responsible in their use of spell energy. Defiling doesn't just kill plants, it also ruins the land, rendering it barren for years to millennia. Just one reason Athas is a horrible wasteland. Also the main reason why everyone hates wizards.

Defiling magic causes pain to nearby creatures; in 2e this was codified as an initiative penalty to anyone within the defiling radius.

All sorcerer kings are defilers (at least those that aren't plot spoilers, heh). Because there's only so much plant life to go around, they still hate other defilers, if only as competition (and also because they might understand the sorcerer king's spells; can't have that!). As a result, the laws of the cities still ban arcane magic (except Tyr, where only defiling is banned), but some sorcerer kings do allow a small number of defiler servants.

Preserving is a much more environmentally-favorable way of casting spells. It only takes what energy is needed and doesn't ruin the land. Unfortunately, most people on Athas are illiterate and ignorant, and can't tell the difference. If they think someone is a wizard, they assume they're a defiler, and wouldn't even know the word preserver. Of course, preserving is more subtle; it's easier to pretend you're using psionics or are an elemental priest or some such, which is one reason the Veiled Alliance is still alive today.

In 2e, defilers gained levels faster than preservers, and could not use preserving magic. (This rule was often broken in the novels, where at least some defilers simply preferred to defile, presumably due to the nearly addictive rush of excess magic.) Whereas preservers could occasionally defile, and doing that too often made them into a defiler permanently. (The wizard Sadira from the novels, a preserver, used defiling almost obnoxiously often, and did get called on it.)

In 4e, however, preserving is the default, at least for PCs. A wizard or warlock can choose to defile, at the cost of harming their allies, in order to reroll a spell's attack or damage roll.

(NPCs often simply inflict damage on everyone nearby, or just on enemies in a certain radius, and sometimes gain a benefit from doing so. The nightmare beast is actually nastier when it misses, since it only defiles when it misses and it does horrid damage with defiling, even before it dishes out continuous lightning and necrotic damage with its spell-like abilities.)

Furthermore defiling isn't quite so harmful, in that defiled land can still generate spell energy; it's basically flavor text. (Of course, defile an area enough times and it still becomes the classic dead arcane magic zone.)
 

TheClone

First Post
For dming 4e Dark Sun you'll definitely need the campaign setting and the creature catalog. The nasty thing about the creature catalog is that it also contains some major story information, especially about the sorcerer-kings and the Dragon of Tyr and not just monsters. For playing Essentials you may need the red box, if you liek to have a non-Dark Sun introduction to 4e. But if you have experience with other rpgs, you don't need the red box. You just need the heroes of the fallen land and heroes of the forgotten kingdoms. Those contain all the information your players need. As a DM you most probably need the Essentials DM Kit. I guess the Monster Vault or the first Monster Manuel will do no harm either, because some monster from at least the MM can be used in Dark Sun and are not part of the creature catalog.

Regarding psionics I'd suggest using the psionic supplement for pre-Essentials builds (Psionic Power is the name iirc). Without any psionic PCs it should be less fun I think. But if you don't like to, leave it out. You don't need the supplement for dming.

I suggest buying a DDI subscription because I found it to be useful. But DDI currently has one major drawback: The character builder has no Essentials builds and no themes. But you can use it to build a psionic character and by that don't have to buy any book for that. And hopefully Essentials builds and themes will be added some day (is there any announcement?). But additionally you have the monster builder and soem free stuff also for Dark Sun to use (like the "escaped slave" theme, the Dragon's Altar location and so on).
 

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