Sacred Fist

[Zhure]

Can a Sacred Fist use a guantlet? Or is it a weapon? It overrides a monk's unarmed damage.

What about armor spikes? Are they weapons?

I'm so confused.

I'm also looking for ideas for the bonus domain for a PC Sacred Fist, something other than the obvious "Celerity."

Greg

 

[Dr. Zoom]

The gauntlet is a weapon that is used to make unarmed strikes that deal normal damage. If a sacred fist or monk wears a pair of gauntlets, he uses them as a non-monk weapon. He cannot flurry with them, use his better UBAB, or get his increased damage for an unarmed strike. This is covered in the FAQ.

Armor spikes, according to the PH, count as martial weapons.

 

[Zhure]

The gauntlet is a weapon that is used to make unarmed strikes that deal normal damage. If a sacred fist or monk wears a pair of gauntlets, he uses them as a non-monk weapon. He cannot flurry with them, use his better UBAB, or get his increased damage for an unarmed strike. This is covered in the FAQ.

Armor spikes, according to the PH, count as martial weapons.

The Sacred Fist can wear armor and still flurry, unlike a monk. Sacred Fists don't get a UAB or get a "better" iterative attacks like a monk, so I'm not sure the FAQ answers are applicable. I'll recheck the FAQ and see if it mentions the Sacred Fist specifically.

A Sacred Fist who "knowingly carries or uses a weapon loses all class spells and features and advances no farther as a sacred fist until he atones for his action." So the question isn't whether he can flurry or what the damage would be, but if guantlets count as weapons? Bear in mind, Sacred Fists can wear light armor.

Greg

 

[Ravellion]

I would say they do (count as weapons)... they are listed in the weapons part of the equipment chapter and have a weapon proficiency level.

Rav

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Gauntlets are weapons. You cannot deliver a touch spell via an unarmed strike with gauntlets precisely because they are weapons, for example. You can deliver the touch spell with gauntlets on, however, via a melee touch attack.

 

[Zhure]

Gauntlets are weapons. You cannot deliver a touch spell via an unarmed strike with gauntlets precisely because they are weapons, for example. You can deliver the touch spell with gauntlets on, however, via a melee touch attack.

I can't find this rule anywhere. Could you help me out with a page number?

 

[hong]

Gauntlets are weapons. You cannot deliver a touch spell via an unarmed strike with gauntlets precisely because they are weapons, for example. You can deliver the touch spell with gauntlets on, however, via a melee touch attack.

The gauntlet description says that they let you deliver normal damage with an unarmed strike, rather than subdual. A strike with a gauntlet is _otherwise considered an unarmed attack_.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

I am going by the FAQ, page 22, last two questions, and page 23, first two questions.

 

[Zhure]

Ah, I assumed you were implying that it wasn't possible to do any touch spells while wearing guantlets. Yes, the rest of that is common sense, and explained in detail in T&B regarding making a melee attack *and* using a touch-based spell at the same time.

Note on Table 7-4, page 98, PHB, "unarmed" is listed as a simple weapon in the same category as guantlets. If we use that as a criteria, then Sacred Fists can't make an unarmed attack and that's clearly not logical.

The only "rule" quote so far that seems to make a case for Sacred Fists not wearing guantlets is that only medium and heavy armors come with guantlets default.

Greg

 

[hong]

I am going by the FAQ, page 22, last two questions, and page 23, first two questions.

I swear, the rules on gauntlets, unarmed strikes, touch spells, touch attacks and whatnot are seriously frigged up.

1) You can make an unarmed strike to deliver a touch spell.
2) You can make a touch attack to deliver a touch spell.
3) You can make a touch attack to deliver a touch spell when wearing gauntlets.

Therefore, you should be able to make an unarmed strike to deliver a touch spell with gauntlets (or spiked gauntlets, I fail to see how adding spikes changes anything).