[SAGA] Mad Skillz!

[Intrope]

Just out of curiousity, I set out to see how fast a Saga character could be trained in all skills!

First: there are 24 'normal' skills, and Use the Force. So I divided these builds between non-force using characters (that can't make UtF checks at all) and Force Sensitive characters.

Every build assumes a Human; point bought with an 18 Int. Also, I only mention Feats/Talents relavant to the increasing skills; other stuff's not listed. The (number) is the number of skills trained at this level.

Note that to get everything as Class Skills, you have to multiclass Nobel, Scout, and either Jedi or Scoundrel.

UnForced:

(13) 1: Noble(1); Feats: Skill Training x2 (6 + 4 (Int) + 1 (Human) + 2 (Feats) = 13)
(14) 2: Noble(2); Feat: Skill Training
(15) 3: Scount(1); Feat: Skill Training
(16) 4: Scount(2); Feat: Skill Training; increase Int to 19
(16) 5: Scoundrel(1)
(18) 6: Scoundrel(2); Feats: Skill Training x2
(18) 7: Noble(3);
(20) 8: Noble(4); Feat: Skill Training; increase Int to 20, gaining a skill
(21) 9: Noble(5); Feat: Skill Training
(22) 10: Noble(6); Feat: Skill Training
(22) 11: Noble(7);
(24) 12: Noble(8); Feats: Skill Training x2

Note that you can use any base class for 7 through 12; you can even switch between them, as long as you do them in even pairs (2 noble, 2 scout, 2 scoundrel, or even 2 soldier or jedi)

Force Users

For Force users, there are several talents that let you substitute UtF for another skill:
Adept Negotiator + Force Persuasion: Persuasion (Jedi Counselar)
Force Intuition: Initiative (Jedi Guardian)
Force Pilot: Pilot (Sense Talent Tree)
Force Treatment: Treat Injury (Force Adept Talent Tree)
Force Deception: Deception (Sith Talent Tree)

You can also do Force Perception (Sense Talent Tree) but it only partly replaces Perception, so I don't count it.

(13) 1: Noble(1); Feats: Skill Training x2
(14) 2: Jedi(1); Feats: Force Sensitivity (from Multiclassing); Talents: Force Intuition
(16) 3: Scout(1); Feat: Skill Training; Talents: Force Pilot
(17) 4: Jedi(2); Feat: Skill Training; increase Int to 19
(17) 5: Jedi(3); Talent: Adept Negotiator
(19) 6: Jedi(4); Feats: Skill Training x2
(20) 7: Jedi(5); Talent: Force Persuasion
(22) 8: Jedi(6); Feat: Skill Training; increase Int to 20, gaining a skill
(24) 9: Noble(2); Feat: Skill Training x2
(25) 10: Scout(2); Feat: Skill Training

Or, at cost of getting to 25 one level later (11), you can have all of the UtF-for-skill Talents (nice, since you can concentrate on Charisma bonus):

(13) 1: Noble(1); Feats: Skill Training, Force Sensitivity; Talent: Force Pilot
(14) 2: Jedi(1); Feats: WP: LightSaber* (from Multiclassing); Talent: Force Intuition
(15) 3: Scout(1); Feat: Skill Training; Talents: Force Perception**
(17) 4: Jedi(2); Feat: Skill Training; increase Int to 19
(17) 5: Jedi(3); Talent: Adept Negotiator
(19) 6: Jedi(4); Feats: Skill Training x2
(19) 7: Jedi(5); Talent: Any Force Talent***
(21) 8: Force Adept(1); Talent: Force Treatment; increase Int to 20, gaining a skill
(23) 9: Sith Apprentice(1); Talent: Force Deception; Feat: Skill Training
(24) 10: Jedi(6); Feat: Skill Training
(25) 11: Jedi(7); Talent: Force Persuasion

*To qualify for Sith Apprentice
**Not counted in Skill Total, since Force Perception is only for some Perception Checks
***Need this third Force Talent to qualify for Force Adept

Now, these aren't terribly *useful* builds, but I find it interesting that you can have 25 Trained Skill by 10th level!

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

A game system that makes Julius Caesar possible? Cool!

 

[ZSutherland]

Just thought I'd point out that, with the exception of Force Perception (I think), taking the Force talents that allow you to act as though you are trained in a skill only counts for attempting Trained Only uses of the skill. It does not, per the designers over at WotC's boards, qualify you for feats or talents that require you to be Trained in a skill. For example, if you do not have Pilot as a Trained skill, you cannot take Vehicular Combat, even though you have the Force Pilot talent.

I admit it's a bit of an aside, but I think it sort of diminishes the value of a Force User being able to use all skills as if Trained at level 10 or 11.

As for your notion that it's not very useful, probably not for a PC, but imagine a heroic NPC droid with this set-up!

 

[Nifft]

If you choose a race with an Int bonus instead of Human, you'll have the same number of starting skills, but your Int-based checks will be at +1 (and you'll probably have two extra languages, or three extra with Linguist).

Cheers, -- N

 

[Intrope]

Just thought I'd point out that, with the exception of Force Perception (I think), taking the Force talents that allow you to act as though you are trained in a skill only counts for attempting Trained Only uses of the skill. It does not, per the designers over at WotC's boards, qualify you for feats or talents that require you to be Trained in a skill. For example, if you do not have Pilot as a Trained skill, you cannot take Vehicular Combat, even though you have the Force Pilot talent.

I admit it's a bit of an aside, but I think it sort of diminishes the value of a Force User being able to use all skills as if Trained at level 10 or 11.

As for your notion that it's not very useful, probably not for a PC, but imagine a heroic NPC droid with this set-up!

Huh! I didn't realize that (and would have thought that they would, except for Force Perception). I mean, you're spending a talent (most valuable of the character resources) to get a skill (least valuable).

And yah, this is more of a thought experiment than useful, although for some kinds of groups having a 'Support NPC' that has filler skills might be useful.

If you choose a race with an Int bonus instead of Human, you'll have the same number of starting skills, but your Int-based checks will be at +1 (and you'll probably have two extra languages, or three extra with Linguist).

Good points, but a human gets *two* extra skills (bonus skill, and bonus feat taken as Skill Training). That's why I used human and not, say, Cereans. AFAIK, none of the other races get a bonus skill directly, or an open feat slot so humans can always end up with more trained skills.

Anyway, it's food for thought. Oh, I should mention: I made this partly because some people had complained that Saga Skills were worse for Jack of All Trades types than regular D&D-type systems. Not so!