Saving Throws: 1/20 Auto Fail/Succeed?

[Chaldfont]

The current group I am playing with says that saving throws fail on a natural 1 and succeed on a natural 20. I'm cool with that being a house rule, but they say that it is the rule in the PHB. I don't buy it. I thought the natural 1/20 rule only stood for attacks.

Which is it?

 

[hong]

IIRC, the Sage said in the first 3rd Edition issue of Dragon (#274) that the natural 1/20 auto fail/success applies for saves as well. It's not in the PHB, but it's been run this way for every edition of D&D since 1E. It's almost the mother of all sacred cows.

 

[Ranger REG]

See the D&D Rules FAQ on the Wizards' web site.

 

[Li Shenron]

The current group I am playing with says that saving throws fail on a natural 1 and succeed on a natural 20. I'm cool with that being a house rule, but they say that it is the rule in the PHB. I don't buy it. I thought the natural 1/20 rule only stood for attacks.

Which is it?

It is a house rule.

Whether it will become a core rule with 3.5e it is another issue.

 

[hong]

Re: Re: Saving Throws: 1/20 Auto Fail/Succeed?

It is a house rule.

A sacred cow is a sacred cow, whether it's in the book or not.

 

[Simulacrum]

This rule is going to DIE

I think the auto success / auto fail rule is BS.
It's just doesnt fit the system.
I love the variant rule that 1 counts as -10
and 20 counts as +30.
Thats the way to go. Please NO AUTO BS anymore.
Who thinks the same?

 

[Kae'Yoss]

While it's not in the PHB, that's probably cause they forgot it. The FAQ says so, several D&D books from Wizards say so, and in other d20 Games - d20 Modern, again from Wizards - it is core rule. And I'm 99.99% sure it will appear in the 3.5e PHB as well. For all I care, it is a core rule.

 

[Simulacrum]

I think that the core rules shouldn't have a niche for *automatic* things in them. It's no good from my experience. why not have it to be +10 -10 modifier instead? For most situation you are able to succed with this rolls but NOT on ANY degree of difficulty. thats my major complain.
Like something has an DC of 99 and a peasant with only a single rank in the required skill gets there and throws a 20 voila perfect.
Now you are pressed as a DM to bend the rules. WHY? because the rule is BS.
Same for AC, Saves etc...and such things happen more often than most would believe.

 

[hong]

Like something has an DC of 99 and a peasant with only a single rank in the required skill gets there and throws a 20 voila perfect.
Now you are pressed as a DM to bend the rules. WHY? because the rule is BS.

In D&D, natural 1/20 autofail/success does not apply to skill checks.

(It _does_ apply in Spycraft, which is perfectly in keeping with the swashbuckling tone of that game, but causes more simulationist gamers heartburn.)

 

[Simulacrum]

yep I checked it again, but it's still far from being logic. Because AC and Saves are nothing else than DC's anyway