Shadow Jump is breaking up friendships

[epicbob]

Thanks for suggestions, so let me give you a little background on these guys to better understand the argument. The shadowdancer player is a min/max person and he is horrible at rping, while the other player is a flavor person and loves rping. So while I understand the ability description is left vague on purpose, I understand both sides and I'm having trouble making a judgement call. The fact these two are arguing isn't that uncommon. At this point I don't really care but with my players taking sides I might need to make a choice.

With such radically different players, a middle ground will be unsatisfactory at best. Based on the ability's other restrictions, I would allow him to count complete darkness as a shadow to jump around in.

For starters, using the full distance empties you for the day. Using it more than once requires making small jumps. As for complete darkness, Darkvision limits sight to 60 feet so any jump longer than his sight range risks him teleporting into an obstacle.

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

I prefer the definition where a shadow must be cast upon something.

Technically, at night, a person is in shadow because the Earth blocks the sun from casting light upon them. But it doesn't feel right because the person is on the surface of the blocking object.

Wheres shadows cast from torches, or an eclipse, feel like exactly the type of conditions a shadowdancer looks for.

 

[epicbob]

I prefer the definition where a shadow must be cast upon something.

Technically, at night, a person is in shadow because the Earth blocks the sun from casting light upon them. But it doesn't feel right because the person is on the surface of the blocking object.

Wheres shadows cast from torches, or an eclipse, feel like exactly the type of conditions a shadowdancer looks for.

If there's a light source powerful enough to generate shadows, I would restrict movement within those shadows. If it's pitch black, with no other source of light, I would allow free movement.

 

[n00bdragon]

I prefer the definition where a shadow must be cast upon something.

Technically, at night, a person is in shadow because the Earth blocks the sun from casting light upon them. But it doesn't feel right because the person is on the surface of the blocking object.

Wheres shadows cast from torches, or an eclipse, feel like exactly the type of conditions a shadowdancer looks for.

How is shadow generated from an eclipse different from the shadow given by say... an umbrella?

 

[Greenfield]

I think he was referring to the dictionary definitions of shadow.

One that applied was, "a dark image or shape cast on a surface by the interception of light rays by an opaque body"

The second one that applied was, "an area of relative darkness".

So, by definition 1, the earth may qualify as an "opaque body", but unless there happened to be a Lunar Eclipse at the moment (with the moon providing the "surface"), simple night wouldn't qualify. Neither would the darkness inside a cave.

Neither would night qualify under definition 2. The mouth of a cave or building might qualify, during daylight hours or if the moon was bright. The simple darkness inside wouldn't, since it lacks the lit area needed for "relative" darkness.


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[Loren Pechtel]

I think he was referring to the dictionary definitions of shadow.

One that applied was, "a dark image or shape cast on a surface by the interception of light rays by an opaque body"

The second one that applied was, "an area of relative darkness".

So, by definition 1, the earth may qualify as an "opaque body", but unless there happened to be a Lunar Eclipse at the moment (with the moon providing the "surface"), simple night wouldn't qualify. Neither would the darkness inside a cave.

Neither would night qualify under definition 2. The mouth of a cave or building might qualify, during daylight hours or if the moon was bright. The simple darkness inside wouldn't, since it lacks the lit area needed for "relative" darkness.


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Thank you--"relative darkness" clarifies my feelings on this and why I don't think night qualifies even though it's in the "shadow" of the planet. I see the shadowdancer as being about moving between those areas of relative darkness. Otherwise it's just sneaking around in the dark, you don't need a special skill to do it.

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

How is shadow generated from an eclipse different from the shadow given by say... an umbrella?

It isn't. I'd accept both shadows as acceptable for the ability.

I think the ruling I would use is that you must enter and exit a shadow at its border. That most cleanly describes how I imagine the ability working.

 

[Greenfield]

The only reason an eclipse came up is because it's the only time there's a surface for the planet to cast it's shadow against.

Definition 1 called for an outline cast against a surface. Without that surface (the moon in the case of a lunar eclipse), night time doesn't qualify.

I personally prefer definition #2, which requires an area of relative darkness. Not just dar, but dark near a lit area.

 

[Cadence]

I love that this thread made me go look up all kinds of definitions I either took for granted or didn't know.

Definition 1 called for an outline cast against a surface. Without that surface (the moon in the case of a lunar eclipse), night time doesn't qualify.

I personally prefer definition #2, which requires an area of relative darkness. Not just dar, but dark near a lit area.

Check out umbra and penumbra though - the earth's umbra is the dark part of it's shadow (the cone starting at the surface and completely blocking out the moon in a full lunar eclipse, it's still there even without the moon to pass through it) and the penumbra is the part of the shadow where it is not entirely dark. (e.g. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umbra and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_eclipse#Types_of_lunar_eclipse or the quotes in the OED)

Would using definition two make it "penumbra jump" instead of shadow jump? ;-)