"Shield Other" question

[KarinsDad]

Greetings and welcome to the new board KD, I thought we might have lost ya.

Howdy Albereth.

Nah, I was just busy and didn't bother to sign up right away. Thanks for the kind words though.

All right. In that case -

If someone recognises that their opponent has a Shield Other spell on them, and that it will take them twice as long as normal to wear them down, can they switch to subdual attacking and have none of the subdual damage transferred to the warding cleric? Or would you say subdual damage is transferred also?

-Hyp.

Subdual damage is not real hit point damage. So, the spell does not transfer it. Thanks for pointing this out. I will be sure to make my players groan with yet another house rule since I am fairly sure that this is an oversight on the part of WotC.

As for weapons, you are -4 to hit when doing subdual damage. So unless you have a real high plus to hit, you will probably be doing only slightly more damage to the Fighter and no damage to the Cleric doing that. All in all, someone switching to subdual (with the typical exception of a Monk) will do less overall damage than someone who doesn't, so I have no problem with it working that way.

 

[bret]

There was an implied question of how to deal with someone else using Shield Other.

I can think of a few ways that would be effective:

• Bull Rush the shielded person out of range.
• Tanglefoot the cleric and retreat. Open up with bows on the shielded person unless they advance to outside the spell range.
• Use an area of effect damage spell to hurt both of them. The cleric will take 1.5 times normal damage.
• Dispel Magic.
• Hold Person or Hold Monster doesn't do hit point damage. There are plenty of things that don't do hit point damage but still neutralize or kill an opponent.
• Dominate the shielded person and have him attack the cleric.

 

[SableWyvern]

Having just now read the actual description of Shield Other, I officially alter my position on the matter.

I am now in agreeance with all those stating that only DR and Resistance effects on the recipient of the Shield Other spell affect the damage. The cleric takes half of all the actual hp damage that would normally be taken by his protected target.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Dominate the shielded person and have him attack the cleric.

Although dominate the cleric and have him attack the shielded person is more fun...

-Hyp.

 

[bret]

Although dominate the cleric and have him attack the shielded person is more fun...

-Hyp.

Agreed. The reason I didn't suggest it is Clerics are very hard to dominate. A good will save combined with high Wisdom makes this less likely to work.

High risk, very high reward.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The reason I didn't suggest it is Clerics are very hard to dominate. A good will save combined with high Wisdom makes this less likely to work.[/B]

Oh, certainly. I wouldn't call it the sensible plan.

But it'd lead to some great stories in the tavern the next day...

"And then the vampire says to Brother Theodore, 'Go on, use your Power Attack!' ... and he did!"

-Hyp.

 

[Egres]

Ok, I know that "thread-digging" isn't a good thing to do, but I was searching for an answer to this question, and I was so surprised to find a Rules question asked by Hypersmurf that I coulnd't help but raise it to new life.

So...

Do you have a definitive answer?

What's the type of damage transferred with Shield Other?

 

[sfedi]

It seems to be that damage reduction of target is the only one that applies.
After that, damage is split in two and applied to each recipient.
No further damage reductions are allowed.

 

[Markn]

Damage with no type

I would have to say that the damage is unspecified and thus no reductions of any kind can be used by the cleric to reduce the damage further. Any damage that the fighter takes, which could be reduced by any defenses on the fighter, leaves damaged divided by 2 that are split between the cleric and the fighter. In case I am not clear here is my example - Fighter takes 50hp fire damage, he has resistence 10 so only takes 40hp damage. The 40 is divided by 2 and 20hp damage of unspecified damage type go to the cleric (even if he had fire resistence he still takes the 20) and the fighter takes 20. IMO, this is logical, not subject to rule abuse and seems to be backed by the letter and intent of the rules.

In the case of subdual damage, none is applied to the cleric since Hyp himself pointed out this is done differently than normal damage.

 

[IcyCool]

I would have to say that the damage is unspecified and thus no reductions of any kind can be used by the cleric to reduce the damage further.

So a troll cleric casting this is pretty beastly according to your ruling. As the damage is neither fire nor acid, the troll only takes it as non-lethal damage.