Shillelagh

[Hypersmurf]

The Greatclub entry in the PHB specifically states that it is the equivalent of a two-handed club... Shillalegh works, although why it is not on the Druid weapons list still eludes me.

If you consider the text to make it a two-handed yet-otherwise-mechanically-equivalent version of a club, then it is on the druid's list. Under 'club'.

And on the wizard's list of proficiencies.

Sorcerers, druids, rogues are more problematic - being proficient in all simple weapons, they are proficient in clubs... and by the 'greatclubs are actually clubs' argument, this would imply they're proficient in greatclub as well... but greatclubs aren't simple weapons.

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This issue existed in 3E, with the Rogue (proficient in 'dagger (any type)') and the Kukri ('This heavy, curved dagger...'). They removed the confusion in 3.5 by redefining the kukri as 'This heavy, curved knife...' to make it clear that proficiency in dagger did not grant proficiency in kukri.

-Hyp.

 

[kayn99]

Going from simple to martial generally gives a one step increase to some aspect of a weapon - bigger damage dice, increase crit range, increased multiplier, ability to trip/disarm, etc.

Making it exotic gives another one step increase.

I do not agree with this logic. It is true with some weapons, but if you work backwards then the long sword is just a great dagger. Club and Great club are two very different weapons and should be treated as such when it comes to the spell. If not, why not cast it on the but end of a pole arm. There is a feat that allows you to strike with it and it is basicaly the same as a staff.

Kayn

 

[frankthedm]

Why use a greatclub when you could use a huge club? It might take a couple of feats, but I don't see why it wouldn't work.

-4 to hit and the cost of taking monkey grip is a bit steep.

1d6 medium club
1d8 Large club -2 to hit {Monkey grip lets you wield in on hand]
2d6 Huge club -4 to hit. {You need Monkey grip to wield in both hands]

 

[Hypersmurf]

2d6 Huge club -4 to hit. {You need Monkey grip to wield in both hands]

Monkey Grip won't have any effect on a Huge club - it works with weapons designed for a creature one size category larger than you.

A Huge club is a weapon designed for a creature two size categories larger than you - the feat won't help, so the weapon is too large for you to wield.

-Hyp.

 

[Caliban]

I do not agree with this logic. It is true with some weapons, but if you work backwards then the long sword is just a great dagger.
Kayn

Isn't it?

Anyway, the logic of creating weapons in 3.5 is just the way the system works, mechanics-wise.

Whether or not you think it's the same type of weapon when you are done advancing it is a philisophical point - the needed weapon proficiency changes when you go from simple to martial and from martial to exotic. (There is also some changes you can make without advancing it a size or changing it's proficiency - some of the weapons just have a price difference. Mechanically a Heavy Flail is superior to a Greatclub, and it just costs more.)

 

[frankthedm]

Monkey Grip won't have any effect on a Huge club - it works with weapons designed for a creature one size category larger than you.

A Huge club is a weapon designed for a creature two size categories larger than you - the feat won't help, so the weapon is too large for you to wield.

-Hyp.

whoops

 

[Trench]

It certainly can work on greatclubs. Our barbarian/druid used that to great effect.

Until our DM gave him a weapon he liked better (despite doing less damage) and fixed that monster.

 

[Plane Sailing]

Mistwell – I see no reason Shillelagh wouldn’t work with Brambles or Spikes. But take note, in the Spell Compendium they nerfed Spikes to only last 1 round per level.

Sounds like less of a 'nerf' and more of a 'bringing it back to reality'