D&D (2024) Weapon mastery and Shillelagh.

[Kobold Stew]

Update in light of PT7!

Now we have a choice of weapon mastery features.:

• a shillelagh made from a club stilll has Slow
• a shillelagh made form a q'staff has Topple.

The situation changes -- it's now advantageous to make shillelaghs from a quarterstaff, used one-handed, assuming you have access t the Weapon Mastery ability. And, often, it will be worthwhile for a non-moon Druid to get the ability through a feat or a 1-level dip.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Versatile is a nice idea - has been since 3.0 (heck, since the TSR D&D "Bastard Sword") - but with martials in general, and fighters in particular, being pigeonholed into hyperspecialization as far back as AD&D, how was it ever supposed to be useful? For switching between 1- and 2- handed use of a weapon to be worthwhile, a character would have to be really good at both modes, and D&D fighter-type can hardly be really good with a second specific weapon, let alone multiple modes of fighting - and those modes would have to be meaningfully different in a way that made switching between them worth doing (rough, in D&D, where weapons are prettymuch just hit & damage).

 

[Yaarel]

I feel the main point of a Versatile weapon is to use the offhand for grappling. Its Weapon Mastery does well to synergize with "Unarmed Strikes", including Damage, Push, and Grapple.

Moreover, the damage of the weapon itself should be two dice increases when two-handed:
• d6→d10
• d8→d12

Hypothetically, but not really:
• d4 → d8
• d10→2d6

 

[Horwath]

I feel the main point of a Versatile weapon is to use the offhand for grappling. Its Weapon Mastery does well to synergize with "Unarmed Strikes", including Damage, Push, and Grapple.

Moreover, the damage of the weapon itself should be two dice increases when two-handed:
• d6→d10
• d8→d12

Hypothetically, but not really:
• d4 → d8
• d10→2d6

do we add heavy as additional damage die boost here?

 

[Horwath]

double post.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Versatile is a nice idea - has been since 3.0 (heck, since the TSR D&D "Bastard Sword") - but with martials in general, and fighters in particular, being pigeonholed into hyperspecialization as far back as AD&D, how was it ever supposed to be useful? For switching between 1- and 2- handed use of a weapon to be worthwhile, a character would have to be really good at both modes, and D&D fighter-type can hardly be really good with a second specific weapon, let alone multiple modes of fighting - and those modes would have to be meaningfully different in a way that made switching between them worth doing (rough, in D&D, where weapons are prettymuch just hit & damage).

Versatile weapons should have two masteries, one for each mode.

For example:
Topple for one handed long sword.
Vex for two handed use.

 

[Parmandur]

Update in light of PT7!

Now we have a choice of weapon mastery features.:

• a shillelagh made from a club stilll has Slow
• a shillelagh made form a q'staff has Topple.

The situation changes -- it's now advantageous to make shillelaghs from a quarterstaff, used one-handed, assuming you have access t the Weapon Mastery ability. And, often, it will be worthwhile for a non-moon Druid to get the ability through a feat or a 1-level dip.

How about a Magic Initiate Backgroind Brawler, casting Shillelagh on random objects?