D&D (2024) Should One D&D bring but Dual Classing

[Benjamin Olson]

Good God, no. Why? How will this possibly improve the game? What problem does this solve?

Careful. If WotC hears that a rule idea serves no particular purpose and solves non-existant problems then they're sure to make it central to the next playtest packet.

 

[Dausuul]

Thinking about hybrid multiclassing in 1D&D...

For spellcasters, it's pretty easy. Each half of the hybrid class gives 50% of the spell slots you'd get for the full class. (It's a little challenging to figure out how to deal with the odd numbers, but there are various ways one could tackle that.) Generally, any time you've got something that's usable X times per day (or per short rest), you can just cut X in half.

For martials, it's tougher; all non-rogue martials rely primarily on Extra Attack, which is not so easily split up. A solution would be to say that you can't use it if you used it on your last turn. (If you have Extra Attack from both halves, obviously, they add up to regular Extra Attack.)

Rogues could do the same thing with Cunning Action, and then reduce their Sneak Attack bonus damage to 1d4 per three levels. (Or 1d6 per four levels, but 1d4 per three offers a smoother progression for the same average damage.)

 

[UngeheuerLich]

That looks easy but I guess it won't work that well.
I'd favour multiclass subclass as mentioned above.
The question is, how you add spellcasting. But the arcane trickster and eldritch knight show how it is done.

I probably would make full caster multiclasses half casters, and half casters third casters when you take them as subclass.
A wizard or cleric would then just give basic spellcasting without anything else. Maybe channel divinity (turn undead) for clerics and arcane recovery for wizards.
Sorcerers might gain spellpoints.
Bards might get a use of bardic inspiration. Maybe they would then downgrade to third casters.
Rogues would get some sneak attack dice and cunning action a few times per day. And so on.

 

[Dausuul]

That looks easy but I guess it won't work that well.
I'd favour multiclass subclass as mentioned above.
The question is, how you add spellcasting. But the arcane trickster and eldritch knight show how it is done.

I probably would make full caster multiclasses half casters, and half casters third casters when you take them as subclass.

That's what we have now. If you split your levels evenly between caster and noncaster, the result is a half caster.

It doesn't work at all. A half caster has far less than 50% of the firepower of a full caster at the same level. The gigantic leap in power from 2nd-level to 3rd-level spells is the biggest reason for this, but even if you just add up spell levels, the half caster is always substantially below 50%.

The hybrid approach I outlined above is designed around the idea that you have the full power of each class, but you can only bring each one to bear 50% of the time. Thus, you get half the spells at each spell level that a full caster would have. If a full caster can throw two fireballs each day, you get one. The round that a full caster would have spent throwing the second fireball, you spend doing whatever your other class does.

There are a number of details to sort out (what do you do when the number of spell slots is odd? how do you keep a hybrid of two caster classes from being simply "you're a full caster with two spell lists instead of one?"), but hybrid is the only way I've seen to make "even split" multiclassing work.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

Snip.

No, it is not. If you split halfway, both classes are 50%. I don't know why youbwant to do it, but whatever floats your boat.
My proposal is getting rod of eldritch knight and take a subclass. So you have 1/2 caster and one full class.
But yes, still not great. But a different way of splitting. Question is, how you would add 1/2 caster subclass to a full caster class...

 

[Neonchameleon]

That's what we have now. If you split your levels evenly between caster and noncaster, the result is a half caster.

It doesn't work at all. A half caster has far less than 50% of the firepower of a full caster at the same level. The gigantic leap in power from 2nd-level to 3rd-level spells is the biggest reason for this, but even if you just add up spell levels, the half caster is always substantially below 50%.

Even if it didn't and it was 75% action economy is still a thing and in most cases you'd get the choice to be a sub-par mage or a sub-par fighter on any given turn. The ranger and paladin both break this limitation, the ranger though Hunter's Mark and the paladin through Smite so their magic directly helps their combat to make up for their not hitting like fighters and barbarians. But multiclasses don't normally get these synergies.

 

[payn]

I dont think hybrid MC is on the menu. Paizo ate that lunch with PF2.

 

[tetrasodium]

I dont think hybrid MC is on the menu. Paizo ate that lunch with PF2.

Pf2 style hybrid Mc is pretty different from 2e style multi clsssing where two classes are taken together or something similar like the kinda dual clsssing houserule someone posted earlier on post # 9 though

 

[payn]

Pf2 style hybrid Mc is pretty different from 2e style multi clsssing where two classes are taken together or something similar like the kinda dual clsssing houserule someone posted earlier on post # 9 though

That sounds like gestalt style. I was commenting on the folks wanting hybrid style of 4E.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

part of me wants to say call what we do now dual classing and bring back multiclassing