Sick of Monk questions yet? Here's one more...

[mysticknight232]

If i wanted to take the Expertise feat, which expertise feat should i take? My Monk wields a Spear, so would i take the Weapon Expertise - Spear feat or the Implement Expertise - Ki Focus feat?

I'm assuming the CB isn't fully intergrated w/ the monk yet because no matter which feat i choose, my character sheet doesn't add the +1 TH bonus generated by either feat. And yes, i double checked that both my spear and ki focus were equiped in the Shop tab of the CB.

Thanks and happy hunting!

 

[Droogie128]

All of your powers are implement powers, so implement expertise would be used most often. The only time weapon expertise would be useful is for MBA's. You could always take versatile expertise...

 

[Mr. Teapot]

Until the CB is updated, you want Focused Expertise (if you use the spear as an implement) or Implement Expertise (Ki focus) if you're using a Ki Focus.


Once the PHB3 is in the CB, you want Versatile Expertise, since it would apply to your spear and ki focus both.

 

[mneme]

*looks over versitile expertise* Hmm. It looks to me as if VE isn't restricted to weapon or implement powers -- if you use your +3 staff as your implement rather than your +2 ki focus, your VE (staff weapon, ki focus implement) should still kick in, yes?

Weapon expertise: You gain a +1 feat bonus to attack rolls with any weapon power you use with a weapon from that group
Versitile expertise: "+1 feat bonus to attack rolls both when using a weapon from the chosen group and when using an implement of the chosen type."

So it seems like monks and sorcerers (and wizards) are the big (accidental) winners -- as they can go "bang, focused expertise (staff + weapon I'm proficient in, or dagger and staff, or staff and wand)" and get expertise with both a weapliment that they're proficient in and another implement that they're proficient in. The big -actual- winners (who need it) are religous and primal characters (particularly clerics, paladins, avengers, shamans, and druids), as well as artificers -- who previously couldn't easily get expertise in both an implement and a weapon, but now can.

 

[Mr. Teapot]

So it seems like monks and sorcerers (and wizards) are the big (accidental) winners -- as they can go "bang, focused expertise (staff + weapon I'm proficient in, or dagger and staff, or staff and wand)" and get expertise with both a weapliment that they're proficient in and another implement that they're proficient in.

A bonus to a second implement or weapon that you use rarely isn't a big deal.

The big -actual- winners (who need it) are religous and primal characters (particularly clerics, paladins, avengers, shamans, and druids), as well as artificers -- who previously couldn't easily get expertise in both an implement and a weapon, but now can.

This is why the change from Focused Expertise to Versatle. Avengers/clerics/paladins/etc. and multiclassed characters had trouble picking up a mix of weapon and implement powers before. Now they can choose some from either camp without one group or the other being less accurate.

 

[mneme]

Oh, absolutely, but it's wonky. Particularly monks, whose versetile expertise gets them either ki focus (good) or "weapon I'm proficient in" (um. stupidly good? this gives them expertise in every weapon they'll ever want to use, for weapon and implement powers). Admittedly, this is basically the desired approach for monks and assassins -- you want them able to pick up nearly any weapon they're proficient with and use it as a weapon of opportunity; that's the whole point of ki focus. But I could see poaching monk just to get "expertise in every weapon" for non-implement users who want to switch weapons (for instance, fighters who use the "switch weapons and attack" at will).

 

[DracoSuave]

Oh, absolutely, but it's wonky. Particularly monks, whose versetile expertise gets them either ki focus (good) or "weapon I'm proficient in" (um. stupidly good? this gives them expertise in every weapon they'll ever want to use, for weapon and implement powers). Admittedly, this is basically the desired approach for monks and assassins -- you want them able to pick up nearly any weapon they're proficient with and use it as a weapon of opportunity; that's the whole point of ki focus. But I could see poaching monk just to get "expertise in every weapon" for non-implement users who want to switch weapons (for instance, fighters who use the "switch weapons and attack" at will).

And to think I thought it was well served for 'Heavy Blade' and 'Axe' or something.

 

[mysticknight232]

could somebody post the Versatile Expertise Feat description? i don't have my book handy and am curious how that reads specifically. thx.

 

[mneme]

mysticknight: My comment above in #4 was a direct quote. I wasn't comfortable quoting the entire thing - -but the primary part I'm leaving out above is "choose a weapon group and an implement type".

Weapon groups are pretty solid -- it's implement types that are all over the map -- from "wand" or "staff" to "weapon I'm proficient in". What's even wonkier is that it doesn't technically limit you to implement types you have access to (but one more or less has to presume it is so limited even though it doesn't say so).

 

[mysticknight232]

seems like VE is the no-brainer way to go here. my plan was to use a spear so i could take the pointed step style feat. so i'll choose Spear and Ki Focus and take advantage of what is essentially a double feat. exciting.