Simple, (hopefully) balanced Vow of Poverty Houserules!

[RUMBLETiGER]

What would you say is balanced and simple enough to use in game? Could make it a move or standard action to turn off each individual "item" or back on, perhaps.

Also, I'm sure you were just calling it that out of convenience for lack of a better term, but this is not a "feat." It costs nothing to obtain, it's just a choice the player makes with its own upsides and downsides.

I do think it is balanced and simple enough to use in game.

I did use the term "Feat" for the purpose of giving myself a mental category to process it out of, but gotcha.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

No, I was asking. Should it be a move action per item? A standard? Or something else entirely?

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

No, I was asking. Should it be a move action per item? A standard? Or something else entirely?

Keep it the equivalent of whatever it would take to don or remove the matching item. This would result in full-body armor taking longer than other slot items.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Armor and weapons would simply be whatever it takes to remove them (you can free action drop a weapon if that's sufficient to the situation). But for everything else? Standard each?

Also, I just realized...should I prohibit the use of extradimensional space items for what you can select? Like bag of holding, glove of storing, etc...? Or is literally pulling stuff out of your ass acceptable?

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Armor and weapons would simply be whatever it takes to remove them (you can free action drop a weapon if that's sufficient to the situation). But for everything else? Standard each?

Also, I just realized...should I prohibit the use of extradimensional space items for what you can select? Like bag of holding, glove of storing, etc...? Or is literally pulling stuff out of your ass acceptable?

I think this system is so different from anything currently in a D&D game that you're now going into "Whatever sounds fun" territory.

With this Vow of Poverty, I can build whatever class and gain magical powers that come from wherever this is sourced. I'm a fighter wearing a tunic and holding a sword, and I can use a series of magical abilities that I can change as I get stronger. If that means I can pull my sword out of nowhere and have it appear in my hand, I don't foresee that being any more or less incredible then summoning a giant wasp with my simulated Amber Amulet of Vermin, getting extra actions with a simulated Belt of Battle or clicking my heels together to activate my simulated Boots of Teleportation.

 

[Loonook]

So the character either has 100 GP of overall, ever cash... Or he has minimum equivalency in magic items. Now, that means that he will be allowed some basic items, not going to ever be able to get above a certain mark of wealth, but you are also going to be pretty far spread for armors, arms, etc. Oh, and you cannot carry a mount, wear any kind of better armor than somewhere around a chainshirt...

And make a hellacious Magus. I can maximize my weapon AND add additional weapon powers and spellcraft to it while casting a spell in a full-attack action?

Yeah, in general Vow of Poverty is kinda supposed to be what it is supposed to be. It is a suboptimal choice given to a devoted individual. There is no need to min-max a suboptimal choice by recutting the wheel.

Slainte,

-Loonook.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

I don't like the atonement part of it. I think the book was right in making willful violations absolutely break it. I do like that you prohibit them from being the target of expensive spells, that was a glaring flaw in the original VoP.

I'm not sure what to do about the raise dead situation, though. I'd be inclined to make raising such a character free, the cost comes out of their essence points.

One other change I would make: While the VoP character can't possess magic items etc, I don't think they should be restricted from using them for the benefit of another.

Consider the following scenario:

"I'm dying and won't live to morning. Please use this scroll of Remove Disease to heal me!"

A VoP character, whether by the book or this version can't do it. I can't see such a refusal as being a good act. 6 seconds to save a life and you say no?!?!

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Using magic items for the benefit of another was actually the situation I had in mind for allowing atonement to fix willingly breaking the vows. It wasn't meant to be a blank check to do as you please then just hit up the church of Pelor. I just figured such a character might inevitably wind up in such a difficult position where doing the right thing would require breaking his vow. Rather than try to add language with all sort of exceptions, leave it up to the DM, etc... I figured it'd be better to just put the atonement clause in so such a character won't be long-term screwed for doing the right thing, rather than trying to define what "the right thing" is.

 

[Loren Pechtel]

Using magic items for the benefit of another was actually the situation I had in mind for allowing atonement to fix willingly breaking the vows. It wasn't meant to be a blank check to do as you please then just hit up the church of Pelor. I just figured such a character might inevitably wind up in such a difficult position where doing the right thing would require breaking his vow. Rather than try to add language with all sort of exceptions, leave it up to the DM, etc... I figured it'd be better to just put the atonement clause in so such a character won't be long-term screwed for doing the right thing, rather than trying to define what "the right thing" is.

I don't think there's anything wrong with a VoP character using someone else's item for their benefit. It shouldn't require atonement.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

I think I know why I'm struggling with this.

If I think "He's trying to alter Vow of Poverty" I get confused. Where are the bonus feats? How can you still carry mundane gear, like weapons?

If I start from the idea of "He's trying to come up with an alternate system of making magical item effects without lugging all that junk around" then I can get my head around this.

So, you want a guy who looks like he's dressed simply, but simulates the effects of various magical items within certain parameters (no expendable items, only one item for each body slot, can apply enchantment effects to multiple mundane weapons and armors). All the money he gets he gives away, because he doesn't need it.

Am I getting this right?