Single melee weapon ranger

[Mercurius]

Well, TS and other multi-attacks WILL far outstrip other powers as you level up. The issue is that with TS you're getting every single static damage boost twice. Take Weapon Focus, you get the +2 damage x2 with TS, etc. So with a total +5 static damage bonus the difference is not that great, but when the damage bonus is higher it will be quite significant. In fact your example isn't super realistic. d10+5 would be pathetic at the levels you'd have a +3 weapon. For instance Prime Punisher + Called Shot by itself is another +5 damage per hit. Assuming you have those 2 feats, Weapon Focus, and a +3 weapon your bastard swords are d10+10 for all attacks.

The problem with those two feats is that I don't have room for them. Including bonus feats, I have Quickdraw, Toughness, Master at Arms, Weapon Prof (Greatbow), Weapon Prof (Bastard Sword or Fullblade), Weapon Focus (Bow), Weapon Focus (Heavy Blades), Improved Defenses, and Hobbling Strike. I'm not sure if Prime Punisher or Called Strike are an improvement over any of those.

OTOH this is all not to say that the single big weapon version will be anything like ineffective. You'll still have all the minor action attacks and immediate attacks, plus your OA will be more effective, so that does help. In any case if you spend 70% of your time using a bow there's not going to be a huge number of situations where it will be a big deal. Still, grab Urgrosh, multi into fighter, pick up Rain of Blows, still a decent way to optimize and if you find the axe to be a fitting weapon then you have the best of all worlds.

Not bad but I'm a sword kind of guy! Or at least for this character.

The damage difference is that you've got minimal statics - a +2 weapon and weapon focus, no? It's the impact of your static bonusses to damage that is doubled.

+3 weapon and +2 Master at Arms for attack, +2 Weapon Focus for damage.

Throw in a pair of bracers (+2 to all melee attacks - although you want the archery ones instead) and gauntlets of blood (+2 damage vs bloodied foes - if you can buy them, do) and:

As you said, I've got to go with the Bracers of Archery over the Armbands. But I didn't know about the Gauntlets of Blood - that's pretty nice for 840 GP!

Fading Strike (Fullblade +3) vs bloodied foe: d12 + 15 = 16-27 HP damage vs bloodied
Twin Strike (Paired Bastard Sword): d10+9 (x2) = 20-28 damage vs bloodied.

Then add in Prime Punisher and whatever the feat is that allows you +5 damage vs your prime shot target for:
Fading Strike: d12+20 = 21-32 (vs bloodied and prime target)
Twin Strike: d10+14 x2 = 30-48 (vs bloodied and prime target)

The big weapon version is a solid backup weapon but not as good as ranger-fu can get. And remember you actually want the archery bracers - although gauntlets of blood and the +5 damage vs prime shot target are both good.

Called Shot might be nice, although I'm not sure I would take it or Prime Punisher over the list of feats above. I suppose I could do without Hobbling Strike, but that just seems so nasty with a ranged weapon.

I'm going to start a related thread, with a challenge on maximizing at-will and basic attacks for a 12th level ranger...I would do it here but it gets away from the topic a bit.

 

[Gorgoroth]

Wow, that's a lot of feats you've spent there on getting the best bow and sword damage. I would totally pick one or the other. Frankly, if you chose to use bracers of archery instead of iron armbands, I'd weapon focus + proficiency in the bastard sword and leave the bow alone. Or *maybe* have bow weapon focus as well. That's just brutal feat cost taking it all double, IMO. Instead of weapon focus maybe take prime shot + prime punisher instead, it's more useful (although you won't get the extra +5 every time, you can time when you drop your dailies and nova rounds for when you gain the prime shot bonus). Think about it : +1 to hit and +5 damage, for two feats, with some minor set up, compared with +1/+2/+3 damage with bows and swords, at the same cost. What's better? Vying for Prime shot bonus makes you game a little bit more variable and will force you to play up your tactics and positioning.

Isn't there a way to use a Ki focus to save on all those double feats? I'd skip out on greatbow prof and use a normal bow, and even quickdraw since you already have Master at Arms. In exchange you can get the prime punisher stuff, a single weapon focus (in the attack mode (melee/ranger) you don't have the bracers for). I'd try to boost damage or get status effects such as debuffs via feats that don't depend on what fighting style you are using.

But good luck fighting! just one thing I'm begging you, get rid of Quickdraw, you don't need it and can replicate it with item/feat properties such as Battle Harness + your Master at Arms feat. How often are you Quickdrawing anyway? 2x per battle, max? Assume you start out each battle with your bow out, or whatever depending on the battle layout you predict (based on scouting or your best guess).

 

[Neonchameleon]

The problem with those two feats is that I don't have room for them. Including bonus feats, I have Quickdraw, Toughness, Master at Arms, Weapon Prof (Greatbow), Weapon Prof (Bastard Sword or Fullblade), Weapon Focus (Bow), Weapon Focus (Heavy Blades), Improved Defenses, and Hobbling Strike. I'm not sure if Prime Punisher or Called Strike are an improvement over any of those.

Honestly, I'd drop the fullblade and the focus on the fullblade and switch to a hunter ranger with a greatsword or a big axe. You get quick draw for free that way (at the cost of toughness). You also get an opportunity attack with Fading Strike.

Just to do the maths on damage:

Assume a four round combat. For the first two rounds you use twin strike, backed by a Fox's Retreat and a Disruptive Shot. And rounds 3 and 4 you use Headsman's Chop and Fading Strike respectively. That's six shots and two sword attacks. I don't think this is an unreasonable scenario? (I'd rather hold onto the bow longer).

Weapon Focus: Sword adds two damage per attack. That's a total of four damage assuming you hit every time. Called shot adds five damage when you have your prime shot bonus. It is therefore more useful than weapon focus (fullblade) as long as you get it once per fight - especially damage at the start of the fight is more useful than at the end. And can make for a nasty opening twin strike - getting +5 damage per attack for each attack. Followed by a Fox's retreat for a further use. Remember you need to use it an average of once a fight to be ahead.

And then there's the fullblade. You in the scenario I've presented get a [4W] attack and a [1W] attack. That's [5W] total. Being generous, we say that the fullblade does an average of 7.5 damage more for that 5W. Now let's compare that to Prime Punisher. +1 to hit (you are always at least the joint closest if you are in melee, so you always get Prime Shot). +5 damage from Called Shot per attack. I think that Prime Punisher beats the fullblade heavily if you've already gone for Called Shot.

Called Shot might be nice, although I'm not sure I would take it or Prime Punisher over the list of feats above. I suppose I could do without Hobbling Strike, but that just seems so nasty with a ranged weapon.

Hobbling strike isn't that good - at least until you add World Serpent's Grasp to the mix. Slow them on the first shot of the twin strike - and knock them to the ground on the second.

 

[RLBURNSIDE]

"(you are always at least the joint closest if you are in melee, so you always get Prime Shot)"

I didn't realize that, thanks! It makes flanking/teaming with the rogue ohh that much better. I figured I'd only get the bonuses if I were closer, but "joint closest" is good enough for me. Is there an FAQ on this, just for due diligence? In case it comes up and I don't want to argue with my DM.

ps, I love the bastard sword, I own one! I think it's much better to hit twice per round == 2x the crits, 2x the chance for quarry, 2x the fun (IMO). In earlier editions rangers and fighters got their second attack at level 6 or so, and it's a big step up in DPR + fun when that happens. I don't think it's very realistic to imagine anyone but an orge wielding bastard swords in each hand, but this IS D&D so why not. Personally, I like the versatility of 4e where you can take a combination of magic item properties and re-skin them to be the guy you want to play, with the mechanics to boot.

Another thought : With 2x Ruby Scabbards, Master at Arms, and a Battle Harness, I believe you can swap to your heart's content.

Round 1: Bow is always out, by default. You're an archer, enemies are initially far away, makes sense, right? Your "un-paired" bastard swords are each sheathed separately, ready for immediate removal on your next turn. Hunter's Quarry the closest enemy, Twin Strike or whatever with your bow, move somewhere.
Round 2: You are in melee, adjacent to an enemy, say, or they close the distance to you. Free action from battle harness to stow the bow, free actions to draw both bastard swords, minor for another quarry, TS, another minor action attack or perhaps it's dead and you want to move to the next one or draw your bow. Fine, Master at arms allows for that, since you use 2 free actions to stow both bastard swords in their scabbards. Actually, come to think of it, Battle Harness is all you need, but the Scabbards and the Master at Arms benefits will probably make your DM just say, ok, fine, to do it.

i.e. ditch the quickdraw, you don't need it. I would still invest in the ruby scabbard(s), just because it's cool. Buy two because pairing and un-pairing is an extra minor action that you can't really handwave away except with Quickdraw. But your purpose is not to save money on an extra scabbard, just pretend like it's an extra fancy scabbard that costs 2000gp instead of 1000gp. At that point there is no game mechanic reason to pretend to go through all these motions. Free actions are unlimited, except for attacks, aren't they?

+++ another vote for Called Shot + Prime Punisher. If you can squeeze out another feat somewhere, it's definitely worth it and you can almost always get the bonus on all your attacks, melee OR ranged. I recently built myself a hybrid ranger | sorc who used Called Shot with his sorcerer powers too, it works great. I did a similar thing but in reverse as you're doing with your paired bastard swords, i.e. imagine a double axe is two battle axes, one in each hand, or even just a single battle axe I attack twice per round with. I haven't decided which visual I like more yet with this toon. The benefit of the double weapon is although I go down in DPR from waraxes, I save tons of cash and have a free hand to hold my rhythm dagger and get +1 AC and Reflex basically all the time. In that case I just imagine that the dagger I wield are the sharp teeth and my draconic agility in combat, + imagine I have all my sorcerer implement powers come out of my mouth. A mouth-plement(c), if you will. With a Lightning Dagger, Fire Dagger, Radiant, whatever, I can basically do any damage type with any of my powers as I can afford daggers, at-will. (thanks to battle harness, ohh I do love that armor). Tough call between that and Predator's Hide though, the extra defenses are very juicy. Against my quarry I have defender-like stats.