Size Tiny heroes

[wolff96]

Arcana Evolved Sprytes have some oddball rules to make it work. They get the tiny bonuses, but only a +2 Dex and -2 Str. They have to use correctly sized weapons, but still take up a five-foot square and threaten the squares around them.

Their base speed is 10', but they get some flight. If you take the Spryte class levels, you get another +2 Dex, +1 spellcasting level, and a few other tricks, as well as better flight manuverability.

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Regardless of that solution -- and they're relatively balanced, in my experience -- tiny PCs have lots of problems and advantages. The biggest being, as others have noted, that they're really hard to find and can do massive damage with anything BUT a weapon in hand.

Spellcasters get a lot of upsides with no downsides and rogues will be nigh-invisible with that extra bonus to their checks.

I wouldn't really recommend it without using some kind of workaround like the AE system.

 

[fireinthedust]

I think size for Ranged weapons could be fixed. The Brownies of Willow had toothpick spears, and while they could use poison, they didn't do damage. Tiny damage should be laughable, or at least unlikely.

Spells... well, if Spellcasting has pitfalls, this should do as well for them. Ie: Call Cthulhu spellcasting wouldn't be a benefit to Tiny casters; they'd only have the same benefits as other Tiny folks. In fact, if there was a physical element to spellcasting, like exhaustion or endurance, it could even be worse to be Tiny.

I don't see that Rogues have it that great either. Do the Tiny modifiers to hit help them enough that it counters the warrior's full BAB? And I'm sure that there are size Tiny arrows/bolts.

 

[Herobizkit]

Here's my take. Shrink the world to suit the new size.

"Medium" becomes the new Large.
"Small" becomes the new Medium.
"Tiny" becomes the new Small.

The Smurfs did it. The Gummi Bears did it. The Littles did it. Willow sort of did it. And it was awesome.

 

[Starfox]

Game balance or not, it is wonderful to say "yes" and allow high fantasy elements if you are playing a high fantasy game.

I had a pixy-like sprite as a PC in my Savage Tide game, and it worked reasonably well. She was a sorcerer. IIR it cost her 2 levels to take the race, which seemed decently balanced. I didn't make her a standard pixie because those have abilities that are best suited to monsters.

Here are the rules I used: Aerie for 3.5

I wrote up alternatives, the Pixie and Coure Eladrin, but we settled for the ones with the least ECL modifier.

I also wrote it up for 4E, but never played this one: Aerie for 4E. In the spirit of the edition, this one has a lot more gameisms.

Edit: The main advantage of tiny size for the character in Savage Tide turned out to be the ability to be in the same space as her friends, which gave interesting positional advantages in tight dungeons and allowed very exact placement of spells like Lightning Bolt. Sure, she had excellent stealth capabilities but 2 levels of rogue applies to a halfling sorceror could have had much of the same effect.

 

[[OMENRPG]Ben]

My first time DMing a 3.5 game, after the system had been out for a few years and my group had nearly all of the books (including many third party), I decided to play a high fantasy game with very low restrictions. I started everyone at effectively high level, 9 if I can recall, and one of my characters wanted to play a Pixie druid (over-powered I know.) Anyway, despite his awesome power through the levels, he was fairly easily captured by an evil wizard and his minions, and ultimately died for it. But, he was terrifying as a druid that could morph into a dire bear and cast buffing spells, dealing more damage than the party's melee assassin.

All in all, game balance went out the window, but a great deal of fun and creative situations came to the table. He was and still is one of the best and most memorable characters in any game I've been involved with.

So I say, go for it! But, if you want to create a sense of logicality, the tiny creatures either need to be highly magical or so mobile/agile that they can't be swatted away in a single hit. I DM'd a one-shot where the entire party lived in a land where Gargans (the equivalent of 'colossal' sized men) ruled. A lot of the gamisms that have developed over the years I completely discarded and just approached it more as a creative and logical exercise rather than trying to apply bonuses and penalties to the tiny (in relation) characters.

 

[Starfox]

But, he was terrifying as a druid that could morph into a dire bear and cast buffing spells, dealing more damage than the party's melee assassin.

Cool story, I like it. But about the issue quoted; isn't that a problem with druids in general rather than with pixie druids?

 

[[OMENRPG]Ben]

Yes, that is absolutely correct Starfox. Although, the issue was compounded because he could fly for free and hide extremely easily. He was never really hit by anything except for magic while in Pixie form due to his size bonuses.

By the way, do a barrel roll.

 

[Zaran]

A Tiny PC should never be a cookie cutter race. It should be made with DM approval and with DM veto power.

I made a Fairie Bard. Her racial powers were a) She could fly b) she could give off light. No bonus to defenses. While she could avoid some monsters with flight big deal. Bards that use Implements avoid melee anyway. And if you are flying above the battle you can't use the fighter for cover from ranged attacks.

I'd say use a gnome or elf in the character builder and just ignore the racial powers. You could give them a bonus to Stealth and Nature skills of +2 and just go with it. The biggest thing is the GM should have the power to say "Yeah, you hit with your sword but you are so small that damage is laughable"

 

[Starfox]

Yes, that is absolutely correct Starfox. Although, the issue was compounded because he could fly for free and hide extremely easily. He was never really hit by anything except for magic while in Pixie form due to his size bonuses.

This sounds like 3.5. That "Fly for free" pixie has an ECL of +5 if I remember correctly. Hardly "free".

 

[Olgar Shiverstone]

General Toot-toot, is that you?