Skirmish.. what the?

[frankthedm]

It takes some investment, but...

GREATER MANYSHOT [GENERAL]
You are skilled at firing many arrows at once, even at different opponents.

Prerequisites: Dex 17, Manyshot, Point Blank Shot, Rapid Shot, base attack bonus +6.

Benefit: When you use the Manyshot feat, you can fire each arrow at a different target instead of firing all of them at the same target. You make a separate attack roll for each arrow, regardless of whether you fire them at separate targets or the same target. Your precision-based damage applies to each arrow fired, and, if you score a critical hit with more than one of the arrows, each critical hit deals critical damage.

Special: A fighter may select this feat as one of his fighter bonus feats.

-Hyp.

If skirmish was not half the damage of sneak attack, I'd be concerned. Considering the scout suffers severe Feat hunger, IMS makes me worry FAR less than a rogue with the same feat and a reliable source of invisability. ANd what book was IMS in?

And seriously, the scout could only pull this of at 12th level. The feat costs to do this rival some PRCs. And the scout has to take rapid shot, which a scout will rarely use since a full round action just is not in the scout's battle plan.

Then again I do houserule most things without living organs have 5 to 10 DR / Slashing or Bludgeoning since peircing weapons need vitals to puncture, so maybe my perceptions are skewed.

 

[Nonlethal Force]

I think it can make sense. Ever wonder why boxers dance in a circle around each other? They aren't just moving because they have restless leg syndrome! There is a significant amount of logic behind the movement. It helps you hit better.

When you move, you see your opponent from different angles. You get to see how the armor lays. You get to see where the thin spots are. You get to see how "thick" they are from the side. You get to see how they use their shield to defend themselves from multiple angles. I'm sure there are other aspects that people can add to this list.

So, I think it makes sense and similarily to the explanation of Mouseferatou up there. It also helpes to break it down between melee and ranged scouts.

Melee: Momentum helps the scout hit harder and see the opponent's weak spots.

Ranged: Movement allows the scout to settle in a spot that exposes the enemy's weak area rather than allowing the enemy to face him with his most protected side.

Both: the movement helps the AC because mobility makes them more difificult to anticipate location.

Again, it isn't perfect. But there is definately enough of a logical base to be viable in my eyes.

 

[frankthedm]

The scout has kinda grown on me. It has an Iron Heroes feel to it. Useful abilities, extra feats, and abilities that should have come from magic items. The player who wanted to me to run Iron Heroes went for the scout when the other players decided to stick with D&D. WHich now makes sence.

Bounding Assault and Rapid Blitz from PHB2 also work nicely with skirmish, though the BAB pre-requisites are steep.

Those feats I feel are too good because spring attack's Move, Attack & Move more than compensates the character since they will rarely eat a Full attack. If they want 'extra' attacks, they can take Improved Trip.

I changed Pounce[ex]: to Bonus Feat:Improved trip when charging, on most monsters because i feel it encourage PCs to shoot for pounce to disrupt the Attack / Full attack system.

 

[Jhulae]

Yeah, but if the scout's moving, the scout is only getting one attack with the skirmish ability.

So, honestly, what's the big deal?

A rogue, who doesn't have to move, gets SA damage on each attack. The Scout, who does have to move, is only getting Skirmish on one attack.

 

[frankthedm]

Yeah, but if the scout's moving, the scout is only getting one attack with the skirmish ability.

So, honestly, what's the big deal?

Teh big deal is "Where is this damage coming from?" it works like sneak, but happens because the scout is moving. The Damage is not exessive and some even say the scout is mildly weak, but the question is not of balance, but perception.

In game How does one attribute the ability to deal more damage because you are moving? Aiming works well if you are not moving, but can be hard to picture in the opposite situation.

If my character eats a more severe wound, my character wants to know WHY in game. If some thief rams a blade deeper in because I lost track of him, thats fine, But when this archer I was keeping my eye on hits me worse because he moved away, I am going to say WTF?

Mostly I view the abilties to boons from Travel, Air or Nature related deities. The skirmish sounds ~o.k.~ from the "hard to keep an eye on pseudo sneak" idea

 

[Jhulae]

Well, where does the Rogue get his SA from? (And why can't fighters, who fight for a living, emulate it?)

If it's the explanation, honestly, I find the boxing analogy more than good enough. A scout's opponent has no idea where, or when, the scout is going to be making her attack since the scout is moving around before striking. That leaves an opening for the scout to slip her blade into somewhere 'vulnerable'.

And, if the question comes up as to 'why can't a fighter do the same thing', well, same reason as why a fighter can't hit vitals like a rogue. Because.

 

[frankthedm]

But with sneak, the victim must fail to be able to percieve or react to the rogue, the scout's damage bonus occurs because the scout simply 'moved'.

 

[Jhulae]

Yes, and because she moved, the opponent no longer has any idea where or when the attack is coming from.

I personally see it as something similar to a Feint (like a rogue would do) except there's no roll involved, as the scout has to move at least 10' to activate it (and possibly incur AoOs while doing so).

 

[Aus_Snow]

Yes, and because she moved, the opponent no longer has any idea where or when the attack is coming from.

Even if she moves 10 feet straight forward, from a position say, 40 feet directly in front of her enemy (who knows exactly where she is), to fire a projectile weapon at said enemy (for example). . .?

 

[Jhulae]

Even if she moves 10 feet straight forward, from a position say, 40 feet directly in front of her enemy (who knows exactly where she is), to fire a projectile weapon at said enemy (for example). . .?

Lots of the same replies could be made about SA, especially why a fighter (who should be very intimate with the best ways of killing someone, such as striking vital organs) doesn't have access to that ability without taking at least one level in a class that has it.

I guess I, personally, don't find it hard to imagine. I can see how others might, though.