Smudged printing, and should I even bother?

[Scurvy_Platypus]

So, I'm trying to figure out whether or not I should ask for the 4th Ed books for XMas. At the end of the day, I've got no idea if the game is going to be cool or not.

If I were to get the books, chances are I wouldn't be getting more than 3 books.

Ever.

Why? I don't see much point to it. I've picked up a number of 3rd party books for 3.x, but I only actually own the Player's Handbook (3.5). No DMG, no Monster Manual.

I've already seen people saying that you should pick up the Adventurer's Vault and a few other books.

For some time now I've had a "3 book" policy. I'm not going to buy more than 3 books for a game line without a _damn_ good reason.

I don't plan on doing that DDI thing or whatever. It sounds like it'd be worthless to me, and I'm not interested in any recurring charges. I don't care about getting Dungeon/Dragon pdfs online either, so I wouldn't be getting any value for that either.

So, should I even bother getting 4E? CCGs out there (like Magic) basically rely on you constantly buying new product. If 4th Ed is set up in a similar fashion, then it means it'll be a waste of money for me.

Also, if I do ask for the books, should I ask for the giftset or not? I seem to recall hearing something about the books smudging, but I can't seem to find any solid information about it. But I thought it was giftset books that were experiencing this. Is it true and if so, are the individual books immune to this or does it affect all the printings?

 

[darjr]

4e is every bit playable and enjoyable in just the three books. I've done it lots already.

 

[Lord Xtheth]

My suggestions are:
4E PHB
4E Monstrer Manual (but ONLY if you're running the games)
4E Campaign Guide of your preferred setting OR Manual of the Planes

These books will set you up with damn near everything you need to run a game.

 

[Filcher]

The 3 books are sufficient. Get them, some dice, and get to rolling!

 

[Harlekin]

I think the smudged ink complaints were mostly about keep on the Shadowfel.

I agree with the previous posters, the core books are all that is needed. And while the DMG covers a lot of known ground, it is also one of the best books about game mastering out there. However, as magic items are in the PHB, it is not strictly necessary.

 

[CharlesRyan]

I wouldn't let any smudging or other production-related issues affect your decision. Every book ever published has had a certain percentage of faulty copies (2% to 4% are typically considered "acceptable" in the publishing industry). Every once in a while, for whatever reason, some sort of critical mass is reached on the internet and the issue flashes out in public. When Eberron came out, there was a consensus on the internet that the entire print run was a disaster. Upon investigation, it turned out to only be a couple dozen copies out of a run of tens of thousands. And looking back, few people if any found their experience of Eberron determined by production problems.

(And regarding smudging in particular: Anything printed in colour on glossy paper can be prone to smudging. We all experience it with magazines. It sometimes seems more prevalent in RPGs because, frankly, they're about the only form of full-colour glossy book most of us deal with on a regular basis--and they get a lot of use.)

What I find more interesting is your strict three-book policy. While I would never advocate that anyone buy books they aren't particularly interested in, why the artificial limit?

 

[delericho]

So, should I even bother getting 4E?

Two questions:

1) Are you dissatisfied with 3.5e in any significant way?

If so:

2) Do you wish to continue playing/running games in the D&D mold?

If the answer to both of these questions is 'yes' then 4e may well be for you. If not, there's probably not much point.

However...

If I were to get the books, chances are I wouldn't be getting more than 3 books.

Ever.

While 4e runs just fine with only the three core rulebooks, it feels much more limited than the equivalent 3.5e core does. Frankly, had my group decided to adopt the game (in the end, we felt it wasn't for us), I simply could not envisage us not adding at least PHB2 and MM2 to the game as soon as they are released.

So, if knowing what I now know about the system, if I were going to strictly follow a "3 books only" rule, I would advise staying away.

One other thing you might consider, though: you could pick up the Starter Set (or "Keep on the Shadowfell") and try the system out for a small investment cost, and then be in a position to judge whether the game is for you or not.

Also, if I do ask for the books, should I ask for the giftset or not? I seem to recall hearing something about the books smudging, but I can't seem to find any solid information about it. But I thought it was giftset books that were experiencing this. Is it true and if so, are the individual books immune to this or does it affect all the printings?

I got the gift set, and it's absolutely fine. In any case, I'm not aware of any difference between those books and the non-gift-set books.

So, I'd go for whatever you can get the best deal on.

 

[guivre]

We're enjoying 4e, despite it's flaws (though there's a good chance we'll be moving back to WHFRP).

However, if I was limited, artificial or otherwise, to three books in this system I'd pass.

 

[PeelSeel2]

If your a player:
PHB, Adventurer's Vault, & Monster Manual

If DM:
PHB, DMG, & Monster Manual

 

[Darkwolf71]

4E was designed to be an 'expansion' game. Sure, people will argue that 3.5 was too, but it's not the same. It isn't all that unusual to find 3.5 games limited to the 'core 3' books. I don't see that happening with 4E. IMO they have managed to design this version in such a way that will 'compel' people to buy their future books (Marketing genius, but good for the game? Time will tell). Can you run/play a game with just the 3? Of course you can. But, I think you will be hard pressed to find others who share that view or are willing to limit themselves as many would for 3.5.

IMO,YMMV, etc, so on and so forth.