sneak attack and iteratives

[Ashtagon]

1) What is the rule regarding whether iterative attacks can gain the benefit of sneak attack damage? I'd prefer cites if possible,

2) Same question for scout skirmish damage and ninja sudden strike damage.

3) Are there any other SA variants?

 

[Crothian]

As long as the rules governing the attack hold true then they get them. If a rogue is flanking with his priomary attack he gets sneak attack damage. If he is still flanking when he makes his second attack he gets sneak attack damage with that.

The scout is a little tougher to get the extra attacks becasue they have to move first. As long as they move the needed distance and then are able to get more then one attack they get the extra daamge.

Ninjas are also a little tougher becasue they don't get the damage with flanking but as long as their opponent is still denied his dex bonus for the second attack he gets the sudden strike damage.

 

[billd91]

1) What is the rule regarding whether iterative attacks can gain the benefit of sneak attack damage? I'd prefer cites if possible,

From the SRD:

Sneak Attack: If a rogue can catch an opponent when he is unable to defend himself effectively from her attack, she can strike a vital spot for extra damage. The rogue’s attack deals extra damage any time her target would be denied a Dexterity bonus to AC (whether the target actually has a Dexterity bonus or not), or when the rogue flanks her target. This extra damage is 1d6 at 1st level, and it increases by 1d6 every two rogue levels thereafter. Should the rogue score a critical hit with a sneak attack, this extra damage is not multiplied.

With respect to any attacks, check the enabling conditions for a sneak attack: target denied Dex bonus or flanked. When the rogue takes his first of any number of iterative attacks, does either condition apply? If so, sneak attack damage applies. When the rogue takes his second iterative attack, does either condition apply? If so, sneak damage applies. etc. Key to the interpretation is "any time" - any time the conditions apply, whether the first in an iterative attack sequence or the last or the middle. If the condition applies, the sneak attack is a go.

It's possible that the loss of Dex bonus might change from one iterative to another. Invisible rogue causes target to lose Dex bonus, after first attack rogue becomes visible, thus no longer causing target to lose Dex bonus is a very common interpretation of those rules. Flanking usually persists throughout the iterative attacks unless some other ability intervenes to move the target out of flank.

2) Same question for scout skirmish damage and ninja sudden strike damage.

The scout's skirmish damage relies on the scout having moved 10 feet or more during the turn (Complete Adventurer p 12). Since that's a move action, full attacks are not permitted and so no iterative attacks can be made. At least not without some other funky power being called on that would allow more movement while still getting in a full attack.

The ninja's sudden strike ability does not apply during flanking but only if the target is denied a Dex bonus (Complete Adventurer p 8). Like the rogue sneak attack above, consult the target's status. If he's still denied his Dex bonus, then each iterative attack can get the sudden strike damage.

3) Are there any other SA variants?

I have no idea.

 

[irdeggman]

Rules Compendium (pg 42) under Precision Damage

A number of abilities in the game alow a creature to deal extra damage by striking a vital area. This category of abilities includes sneak attack and other abilities that work like it, such as a ninja's sudden strike and scout's skirmish. . .

Precision damage applies on any attack that meets the requirements of the ability that grants the damage. This includes multiple attacks made during a full attack. If conditions somehow change between multiple attacks, attacks that no longer meet the ability's requirmeents can't deal prrecision damage. . . .

A form of attack that enables an attacker to make multiple attacks during an action other than a full-round action, such as the Many shot feat (standard action) or a quickened scorching ray (swift action) allows precision damage to be applied only to the first attack in the group.

 

[Ashtagon]

Cool. Essentially, the only thing likely to change the circumstances significantly is the ending of an invisibility effect as a result of making the first of the iterative attacks.

 

[StreamOfTheSky]

Cool. Essentially, the only thing likely to change the circumstances significantly is the ending of an invisibility effect as a result of making the first of the iterative attacks.

That's why there's a greater invisibility spell.

Or just put them on greased flooring/ground. Then without 5 ranks in balance, they'll be flatfooted until they escape it!

 

[Dandu]

Or blind them.

 

[Ashtagon]

Or blind them.

How do you blind someone during their iterative attack sequence?

 

[Nebten]

No, the person you are attacking is blind, thus flat-footed (unless they have a reason not to be).

 

[irdeggman]

Even better - the attacker is considered invisible to them thus not only are they denied their Dex bonus to AC the attacker also gets a +2 to attacks.