So, Dark Sun: It's officially out. What do you think of it?

[Tzarevitch]

I am completely delighted with the job they did on DS4e. It is better than I hoped. I only have minor quibbles.

1. The mount traits aren't done well. They completely lost the mechanical benefit of the different mount types. Kanks are like Athasian camels. They don't require as many resources on long trips in the desert. Inixes had carrying capacity well higher than everything short of mekillots. They used to be bigger and able to carry multiple riders in a Howrah. Mekillots don't seem to have enough dragging capability to pull an argosy anymore. They also shrunk.

2. Muls and dwarves are hairless - always. Muls are sterile - always.

3. Male half giants have long braided hair, unless they cut it off. Half giants could stand to be a foot taller on average and a few hundred pounds heavier. They should look bulkier in the artwork. The males in particular look too much like muls right now and they aren't much bigger. They should stay medium size though.

4. The mention of elf overland run speed is a mechanical benefit. It shouldn't be buried in flavor text where it is hard to see. (They can run 40miles/day. Faster than many of the mounts.)

5. Tieflings are pretty pointless. They don't have much function except as one more race of desert raiders. They needed a better backstory like the eladrin and dragonborn got.

All of my quibbles are easy to fix DM-side. All in all I am spectacularly pleased.

 

[bert1000]

Over I think they did a good job but not wowed.

Pleased:
* it's dark sun and they didn't change any of the big tropes
* mechanics are very good. love themes, wild talents
* don't have it yet, but likely will love the creature catalogue since I think WoTC has been doing some pretty good monster design lately
*liked how they stuck with the themes for the city states, but got a little away from direct transports of real world history. in 2e (esp. veiled alliance), I almost felt like this was what happens when you play out Civ for 2000 years...

Not so great:
* art direction. as others have pointed out, the art itself is not bad but it doesn't convey the setting as well as I would have liked. 1/2 the artwork looks like stock pieces with no DS connection. the other half is inconsistent. needed more landscapes, city scenes, action scenes, etc. (Why have the wyvern looking thing in one of the 2 page spreads instead of a Gaj?) I don't need Brom incarnate, but some other consistent style vs. standard 4e would have set it apart. Also, I like catalogue type art work in my campaign guide. For instance, there were great pictures of the clothing styles of people living in Gulg and Nibenay in the old box set. Those are the types of artwork that really enhance things for me. It would be great if each city got a blimp overhead view plus "citizens" portraits.

*felt really abridged. Dark Sun races could have had a whole page each in my book. For instance, if I didn't own all the 2e stuff, reading the few paragraphs on Halfling really wouldn't have given me a good feel for the race. I am ok with leaving things vague and not defining a lot of “why” but could have used more “what”. Thought Eberron guide had many more plot hooks in it.

 

[TikkchikFenTikktikk]

The residents of Athas are going to be very surprised when my players find and assemble the pieces of The Gate Wheel.

For on that day the primal barrier barring the return of gnome-kind to their true home will be unlocked.

On that day the fleet of gnomish spelljammers entering from the Astral Sea will darken the sun.

On that day the reckoning brought upon the sorcerer-kings will be terrible, as will it be upon the disgusting halflings who enabled the gnomish genocide.

On that day the gnomes will usher in the new Green Age, terraforming the blasted landscape into the pastoral homeworld they have been denied for so many aeons.

On that day...

 

[TarionzCousin]

On that day...

... the Sorcerer Kings will rise up as one--in unheard-of and unthinkable cooperation--and blast the little buggers from the skies. Their charred bodies will plummet to the ground, fodder for hundreds of halfling feasts. The very fabric of space-time will be rent asunder as the Feywild is forever separated from the Material Planes.



/actually, a gnomish invasion sounds cool, if a bit silly.

 

[Obryn]

Thanks but I was more talking about how far on from the initial time line.

For example in the original Dark Sun there was an adventure called Freedom about the liberation of Tyr from it's Sorcerer-King, but in 4th Ed, the Sorcerer King of Tyr is already dead. So you can't go coverting Freedom to run in 4th Ed.

I was wondering home many other adventures from 2nd Ed are similarly effected.

Sure you could. Honestly, if you have Freedom, you have all the Tyrian flavor you need.

Kalak's death is considered recent history, but it's your game. Place it when you want. Heck; Kalak's stats are even in the creature book, should you need them.

-O

 

[theskyfullofdust]

Question for those that have the books: how did they flavour the inclusion of the eldarin and dragonborn (who are Dray, yes?), and how did they not do the same for the tief's?

 

[Stumblewyk]

Question for those that have the books: how did they flavour the inclusion of the eldarin and dragonborn (who are Dray, yes?), and how did they not do the same for the tief's?

They made an effort to include the Eladrin and Dragonborn. Dragonborn are the Dray, which were already established in the Dark Sun mythos. Eladrin, while a bit of a shoehorn, work - they're still creatures of the Feywild, but the Feywild is a nasty place, just as tortured as Athas, and Eladrin blame Defilers (and arcane casters as a whole) for the destruction of their homeland.

Tieflings on the other hand? They get about 2 paragraphs, that basically amount to "they're really mean people who prowl the wastes attacking settlements and travellers. Oh, and they made a pact with a dark power way back in their history that no one understands or remembers, but it helps them survive."

So...they're savage Tieflings from PoL then? Thanks, Wizards.

 

[Siberys]

Sure you could. Honestly, if you have Freedom, you have all the Tyrian flavor you need.

Kalak's death is considered recent history, but it's your game. Place it when you want. Heck; Kalak's stats are even in the creature book, should you need them.

-O

Really? I didn't see him on my pass through...

 

[Obryn]

Really? I didn't see him on my pass through...

I'm going by hearsay, mind you, but he was in the list of sorcerer-kings with levels and roles that I read.

Amazon still has my own copy in release limbo.

-O

 

[Siberys]

Going through, it doesn't look like he is. Still, though - it shouldn't be too hard to stat him if you need him.