So THAT's why Regdar gets no love...

[CountPopeula]

I have an opinion on the iconics in general. I don't care about them. This is a bad thing if you're a publisher. You know who I care about? Elminster, Drizzt, Alias and Dragonbait, Tenser, Bigby, Mordenkainen, Tasha, and so on.

If you want to have iconic characters in your product's artwork, give people a reason to care about them beyond "there's that hot barbarian chick again." Make them important to the game. Mialee was supposed to be an iconic wizard, so why was there never a spell called "Mialee's Inspiration" or some such. Why wasn't one of the tactical feats called "Redgar's Gambit?" Why were supposed to care about these characters? the mini-replays? Maybe if the characters were stars of a replay series that was printed every month in Dragon, then i would start to care about them.

But seeing the same characters again and again doesn't make me feel any particular fondness for them. Of course, this can be a double-edged sword, too... people hate Drizzt as much as they love him.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

Mialee was supposed to be an iconic wizard, so why was there never a spell called "Mialee's Inspiration" or some such.

There was, but the material component consisted of an outfit made up entirely of pockets, and they realized that was too silly to demand of anyone.

 

[Nifft]

the material component consisted of an outfit

I wish such a spell existed in the real world.

"I cast PAR-TAY!", -- N

 

[beepeearr]

Regdar: white (most often depicted unambiguously so, otehr than Lockwood's initial work).

I have no clue, the PHB and scourge of worlds both point to black or at least bi racial, but the original 3e Stand up was white.

Alhandra: White.

Maybe, but I still think she looks more hispanic then white.

Hennet: White.

White, really?

Naull: who? (Googles around) Oh, her. Does she even count? I mean, yeah, but she's not really an iconic, is she?

Also not white, and yes she was technically an Iconic

 

[Barastrondo]

D&D is not a middle age setting. D&D is D&D.

Yeah, a genuine middle ages setting wouldn't have all of this "upward mobility" nonsense where a humble peasant can, a few hundred thousand experience points later, become some sort of cross between landed gentry, culture hero and rock star. The very level system that proclaims that anybody can become a world-shaker with enough experience points kind of gives the lie to a genuine Middle Ages Europe dynamic. It's very modern First World in nature.

The whole wish-fulfillment factor of starting out a peasant and ending up a warrior-king is much more fairy tale than historical fantasy. And fairy tales are pretty dang universal.

 

[SteveC]

For me, the real problem with the iconics was that they were, frankly, kinda lame. Almost none of them had any personality and attitude that made them interesting or distinctive.

Why was Regdar the default fighter? Well his armor and equipment was at least interesting to draw. Tordek was just an uninteresting character in the extreme.

Now in the PSAs, he's fantastic (see: D&D Debates: Elves Versus Dwarves).

Oh, and In Before the Lock!

--Steve

 

[I'm A Banana]

Almost none of them had any personality and attitude that made them interesting or distinctive.

*sigh*

THAT'S THE FRIGGIN POINT, SON!

 

[ProfessorCirno]

How is racism involving Monte still coming up? It has NOTHING TO DO with racism.

I refer again to my comment of "Some people have too much free time on their hands."

Marketing tried to be snide pricks towards the designers and artists. The artists decided to be snide pricks back. That's how jobs work.

 

[CountPopeula]

*sigh*

THAT'S THE FRIGGIN POINT, SON!

Then the idea of iconic characters is a poor idea. "Here are some bland, generic characters. You'll be seeing them all the time, but they'll never be doing anything interesting."

There's a reason Star Trek was about Captain Kirk and Spock and Dr McCoy et al. and not about Ensign Ricky. Star Wars is about Luke and Han and Leia and Lando, not Bantha Handler B. So why should the iconic characters in D&D be bland, uninteresting background characters? Why not use the characters people actually care about to sell products?

 

[mhacdebhandia]

She's the only black iconic, but what about Regdar, Alhandra, Hennet, and Naull?
Jozan's the only white human, except maybe Kerwyn (I can't tell with him).

Regdar was designed as mixed-race by Todd Lockwood but more often than not painted as white by other artists.

Alhandra is white in the Player's Handbook - she might look Spanish or Italian with her dark eyes and hair, but she's still entirely European. Hennet is white in the Player's Handbook - the novel cover upthread makes him look pretty different from his original portrayal, and other artwork hews closer to the original. Naull has some Asian features, but she has extremely pale skin. Kerwyn, again, looks Mediterranean French or Italian, but still completely European.

You just don't see people looking like this in most D&D products, and I think that's a shame:

(Vietnamese)

(Swahili)

(Maya)

(Inuit)

(Austronesian)