Some soul knife questions

[Sir Pentor]

One of my players may consider becoming a soul knife. He pointed out some things that I'm not sure of and wanted some other opinions.

1) Is the mind blade always a light weapon? Obviously it is light when it's a short-sword. But once you get the upgrade to a longsword, does it retain it's light weapon status? It matters for two-weapon fighting. It also matters because a halfing would not be able to use the long-sword version one-handed.

2) Can he use the mind blade as a dagger? Doesn't really matter, but sylistically he may want a dagger some times.

3) Can he form a double-weapon out of the soul knife? I say yes. Does he need an exotic weapon proficiency to use it (in addition to ambi and 2-weapon)? I say this depends on the answer to question 1. If they are light weapons, then he could just fight two-weapons, rather than double-weapon and get the same attacks and damage, so fighting with a double-weapon is only because it's cool, and does not require an exotic weapon proficiency. If it is not a light weapon, then it will require an exotic weapon preficiency.

4) If he casts polymorph self on himself, what happens to the mind blades he creates afterward? Normally a weapon grows with you (so a medium-sized longsword grows from doing 1d8 to doing 2d6). How about the mind blade that you are holding, or one that you create after you are big?


What do you guys think? Thanks

 

[rhammer2]

I've had to think about this already, one of my players is a soul knife.

1) It's a magic effect, treat it as a light weapon always.

2) This one I hadn't thought of, don't see any reason why he can't have a shorter weapon if he wants.

3) I wouldn't allow the creation of a double weapon.

4) The weapon's damage is a matter of level, don't scale it up with an increase in size.

One of my players may consider becoming a soul knife. He pointed out some things that I'm not sure of and wanted some other opinions.

1) Is the mind blade always a light weapon? Obviously it is light when it's a short-sword. But once you get the upgrade to a longsword, does it retain it's light weapon status? It matters for two-weapon fighting. It also matters because a halfing would not be able to use the long-sword version one-handed.

2) Can he use the mind blade as a dagger? Doesn't really matter, but sylistically he may want a dagger some times.

3) Can he form a double-weapon out of the soul knife? I say yes. Does he need an exotic weapon proficiency to use it (in addition to ambi and 2-weapon)? I say this depends on the answer to question 1. If they are light weapons, then he could just fight two-weapons, rather than double-weapon and get the same attacks and damage, so fighting with a double-weapon is only because it's cool, and does not require an exotic weapon proficiency. If it is not a light weapon, then it will require an exotic weapon preficiency.

4) If he casts polymorph self on himself, what happens to the mind blades he creates afterward? Normally a weapon grows with you (so a medium-sized longsword grows from doing 1d8 to doing 2d6). How about the mind blade that you are holding, or one that you create after you are big?


What do you guys think? Thanks

 

[ConcreteBuddha]

I would think the damage would increase with size. A Storm Giant's Mind-blade would be a tad bigger than a halfling's.

(I also think small characters have smaller blades: daggers and short swords.)

Psi Handbook PG. 114

"...it is identical to a short sword and deals 1d6 piercing damage."

This leads me to believe that a Storm Giant would wield a Huge Short Sword/Mind-Blade. Using the weapon size advancement rules it would deal 2d6 damage. (SoF pg. 62)

The damage should not be 1d6 across the board.

An awakened ant Soulblade should not deal 1d6 with his mind-blade.

 

[ConcreteBuddha]

Sorry for double posting, but I forgot something:

The weapon is only light if it is one size smaller than you.

Psionics Handbook pg. 114

"His mind-blade's base characteristics are now those of a long sword, so that it deals 1d8 slashing damage. The soulknife can use the upgraded mind-blade as long as his power reserve is seven or more."

The upgrade is a long sword. It is not a light weapon to a human soulblade.

However there is nothing saying that you can't use the short sword incarnation of your mind-blade instead. In fact, it is implied in the power reserve requirement that you can change between the two.

As per my previous post:

On second reading of the description of the mind-blade, I read this:

"the soulknife creates a semisolid blade 1 foot in length" pg 114

I can see how people would use this description to infer that the short sword doesn't alter in size if the user changes in size. If you want to play that way, go nuts...

If just find the idea of smaller or larger soulknives using 1 foot blades absurd.

 

[Zhure]

I wouldn't let the soulknife make a double-weapon. It would allow them to make a Large weapon, which is bigger than the base mindblade or the upgraded version.

I'm sure the DM would let you tweak that ability in, but only by giving something else up instead.

Greg

 

[rhammer2]

The soul knife is a class spell like ability, and the damage is based on the level of the psionic not the size. At the moment I can not think of a single spell that will do damage that is variable by the size of the caster. Why would you do so to this spell like power?

I would think the damage would increase with size. A Storm Giant's Mind-blade would be a tad bigger than a halfling's.

(I also think small characters have smaller blades: daggers and short swords.)

Psi Handbook PG. 114

"...it is identical to a short sword and deals 1d6 piercing damage."

This leads me to believe that a Storm Giant would wield a Huge Short Sword/Mind-Blade. Using the weapon size advancement rules it would deal 2d6 damage. (SoF pg. 62)

The damage should not be 1d6 across the board.

An awakened ant Soulblade should not deal 1d6 with his mind-blade.

 

[EOL]

I'm going to have to agree with rhammer on this one. Just because the creature is huge I don't think his mind-blade damage should change. It's a mental effect think Yoda and Luke, size does not matter.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

If you go to montecook.com, go to the Stuff Archives, and download Bruce Cordell's revised PrCs. This answers most of your questions.

In a nutshell, the upgraded mind-blade is still a light weapon (it's only semi-solid), and all feats that apply to the short weapon also apply to it, including Weapon Finesse.

 

[ConcreteBuddha]

"This ability works just as described on page 114 of the Psionics Handbook." -unofficial web Soulblade by Bruce Cordell

This doesn't clear up anything.

"The soul knife is a class spell like ability, and the damage is based on the level of the psionic not the size."

A nitpick: the damage is not based on the level of the soulblade. A soulblade can manifest a long sword at 8th level. The damage is that of the long sword, not the soulblade. You are thinking of it as if it's a monk.

"At the moment I can not think of a single spell that will do damage that is variable by the size of the caster."

"I'm going to have to agree with rhammer on this one. Just because the creature is huge I don't think his mind-blade damage should change. It's a mental effect think Yoda and Luke, size does not matter."

Along these lines:

Are you guys seriously trying to tell me that if a Storm Giant Psion were to manifest, say, Call Weaponry, it would be a Human Sized weapon?

That manifestation's damage "is variable by the size of the caster". So is Polymorph Self and Shapechange. It's based on the size of the weapon the character can wield, not the actual spell itself.

Real Weapon vs. Psionic Effect

Now I would agree that damage shouldn't change if this were something like Spiritual Weapon or Flame Blade, were feats and strength do not count.

But I contend that it is a "Creation" manifestation and that the blade is real in every way. Hence, why it can be broken, you can use feats on it, and it gets a strength bonus or penalty to damage.

"As long as he holds the blade, it is identical in all ways (except visually) to a short sword" pg 114

If the damage was purely psionic, as you guys propose, then SR or PR would apply to damage from a mind-blade, and DR would not.

Since this is not the case, we must assume that a "real" weapon is doing the damage. And a "real weapon's" damage is based on size.

Now I feel it was an oversight on the maker of the PrC to not include alternate sizes for the Soulblade.

I just think it's silly that a twenty foot tall creature would be wielding a one foot mind-blade.

I also don't consider it "overpowering" at all.

So what if your player's got a Psi Warrior/Soulblade who polymorph selfs into a Troll and uses his large long-sword-mind-blade? He does what....2d6 damage! Who cares? He's Level 18!

Anyway, do whatever floats your boat...but if you make a mind-blade into a Magic-Missile-Stuck-to-your-Hand, please be consistent and not give the characters a bonus or penalty to damage based on Str, don't let the blade be disarmed or broken, and make sure PR is effective against it, not DR.

 

[Sir Pentor]

Thanks for all the replies. I definitely side with the group that thinks it is not magical and it grows and shrinks with the character.

One thing I don't understand is the group of people that says the character shouldn't be able to create a double weapon. My question is: why not? You can make a longsword and shortsword and fight two-handed, right? Why not make them take a feat to be able to use the double-weapon effectively?

Thanks