"Speaker in Dreams" is one of the twinkiest adventures ever written

[S'mon]

The PCs in my campaign have +1 weapons at 9th level (well, 1 just got his upgraded to +2) and they seem to have fun...
I like to use monsters, demons, et al - I just like to have a good reason why they're there. I believe in credibly maintaining suspension of disbelief, which some people don't seem to care about - eg if the highest level spellcaster within 100 miles is 8th level, you're not going to be able to buy +5 swords on the open market. If there are any, they're legendary relics and either in the possession of the Duke's champion or at the bottom of some ancient dungeon. Likewise, my cities don't swarm with half-fiend dire celestials or whatever.

 

[hong]

As an example I would take SHARK's campaign. From what I have read of his games, they seem to be pretty high fantasy, but something tells me his game is awesome to play with and not "Baldur's Gate II" at the gaming table.

Hey! BG2 was pretty darn awesome, if I may be so bold. And Planescape: Torment was just as good.

Sorry for the Rant, I just get tired of seeing my gaming style titled as wrong.

Felon just likes engaging in drive-by bombings.

He does get a little sensitive when people shoot back.

 

[hong]

Conan managed to become a king without a +5 vorpal sword.

No, he just had Plot Immunity, which is worth a thousand +5 vorpal swords.

 

[arwink]

Re: Re: "Speaker in Dreams" is one of the twinkiest adventures ever written

Goober. Traditionally, it's elves that are cobblers. Duh. Polymorphed dragons usually sell linens, or run the local money changers.

Unless your in Threshold. Then I think their potters or beggars, I can't remember which.

 

[Fenes 2]

IMO, many of the magic items in the game are just "more powerful versions of the same old, same old". This is especially true for the "+ x to y" items. What options do those items deliver? Nothing, just a boost in numbers, which the DM will take into account when desighning his adventure, mostly by choosing a more powerful monster (hopefully not only beefing up the HP and AC and DR).
What is so wondrous about a +5 sword if everyone has one? Nothing. On the other hand, if it is the only +5 sword in the whole country, then it truly is a wondrous item. IMC, any magic weapon will have a history, and be something special. You may only have a +2 Sword at level 11, but most of your enemies, and almost all of your allies will not have magic swords. People will have heard of your sword, and some sinister forces may already be planning to take it from you.

Now, magic weapons and items that offer new options are different. What is another +1, or more damage, to Darkness 1/day? Or to Feather Fall?

I especially hate the +x to stat y items - absolutely not neccessary, offering no options, just a boost in numbers. Good riddance.

And before you state that those + items are needed at higher levels, or the party may never fight "Monster Z", thereby being confined to keep slugging it out with orcs: I have no problem using all those creatures in the MM with some sligfht adjustments when I need a monster. Recently I took the Boneworm from the WotC website and used it, adjusted, against my party. I had to tone down several powers and the DR to compensate for the lack of "+ items" in the campaign, but essentially the battle was the same as if the party had been equipped according to the DMG.

In conclusion I like a fantasy world where magic is not common, and the different monsters, spells and items that are encountered are special, as are the PCs.

 

[SHARK]

Greetings!

Hey there King Stannis my friend! I see what you're saying now. I agree. Characters shouldn't be floating in magic items when they are 5th level, and even should the time come where they are powerful, and have many magic items, it should be that they fought and bled severely and paid a great price in pain, death, treasure, and misery to gain such powerful items. The player character's rise to glory and greatness should be a dreaded, painful climb up the stairs of destiny, slick with the blood of the conquered, and littered with the crushed and moaning bodies of the damned!

Tsunami! How are you? I haven't heard from you in awhile my friend! You should write me! Amen indeed!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[Bagpuss]

No polymorphed Dragons selling shoes?

Actually there is one in the web-enhancement, although I think she (a young silver dragon) a beggar not a cobbler.

I happen to agree that Speaker in Dreams is a terrible senario, although not due to the mix of monsters. More due to the fact it could be a good 'detective' style adventure but instead either leads the players round by the nose, or throws random encounters at them to move the plot along.

The plot tree in the back of the book is incorrect, it shows clue paths where there are none. The assassin in it isn't a high enough level rogue to qualify for the prestige class. Its just poorly written.

Oh and I have run it much to my regret.

 

[Arthur Tealeaf]

I ran it.

HELL to run!

But... It was fun for my players!

Mainly because I added a LOT of elements.

I actually winged them at first, then went with it as time went by.

Especially one npc guard who became a very good friend who sheltered them, helped, gave them info and stuff.

I included some rooftop battles, and I manage to lure the players into insane stunts, throwing themselves across rooofs aided by thin ropes while being chased by mad gargoyles.

And the plan they made and executed to break into the baron's fort, it was delightful! Scouting out guard routes and employing strange tactics.

It was actually quite memorable!

But if I had ran it by the book, it would probably have been very boring

They didn't even visit the temple, that is supposed to be one of the main adventure sites!

 

[jasper]

Mr. Fred has became a medium villian IMC. He is slighty mad at the PC for destorying his plans.

This module did not work well with my group because they miss clues and not all the players attended all the time which broke the chain of thought.

Ms Silver is now a partner with the mayor.

The clue tree in back is wrong but it helps.
But my group when from pt D to pt T

 

[starkad]

There's a theme here, in the bashing of this module, that I find a little disturbing.

Some of them don't follow it, but a majority of them do...

If you run a module as 'vanilla' and quoted directly from the book... Of course it will be dull and boring and 'not special'. You need to, as a GM, invest time and loving care into everything you do. You need to read the module 10-20 times all the way through, before you run it. You then need to say to yourself 'Hm... Well this X monster doesn't fit well for my game... Let me modify it like this.. And add this plot element... And ah ha! Perfect!'

Modules are like the D&D game in general... Great to use as an outline, but very free form and wanting attention and change at every turn.

There has yet to be a single module to me that, run as vanilla, worked great. There always needs to be fleshing out. If you devote time and interest to a module, and revamp it so that it works in your game better... It will show, and not only will your players like it more, you will too.

Which brings me to another point.... Just because -you- don't like it, doesn't mean your players won't. I've run several modules that I utterly detested, but my players loved it. It took me a while to get over my selfishness(that's exactly what it was for me.. Wanting to control it for my pleasure all the time), but when I did, I enjoyed it more, because I didn't take it personally. Yes, I need to have fun running a game, or I lose interest... But I can throw in minor 'off the cuff' or 'winged' ideas that really make my game more interesting to me, and keep my interest, if I don't like what's going on.

That's the key to being a good GM... Being able to recognize flaws and change them as you go for fun and coherence.