Spell Point magic system - who uses one?

[GlassJaw]

One of the variant rules I've always been interested in is a spell point magic system. I've checked out the UA system as well as worked on a similar system of my own but I've always been a bit hesitant to use it in an actual campaign.

One thing I've always debated is the balance between casting flexibility and spells per day. How "valuable" is the flexibility a spell point system grants?

For example, if you calculated the actual points the wizard and sorc spell charts would grant, the total is a lot less than the spell point charts in UA. The problem is that if you give the casters a number of points based on their spells per day charts, they would be able to cast a greater number of higher levels per day than they normally could.

This is one of the concerns I have with the spell point system. I really like the "mana pool" concept but I would love some input from those that have used a similar system in their campaigns. Also, if you made changes or use a slightly different system, I would be curious to hear about them as well. Thanks!

 

[GlassJaw]

No love for spell points?! :\

 

[Verequus]

I'm using Elements of Magic Revised (available on RPGnow, a thread regarding to it is in the EN Publishing forum), which has nice and functionable spell point system, but throws out the division between arcane and divine, so it could be something, which would be too much of a change to you.

Basically, with spell point systems like from Unearthed Arcana there is the caster level problem. Until the 11th level you would only cast fireballs, because you get for the same amount of spell points a better result - only damage caps prevent/hinder the use of fireball in higher levels, at least for the BBEGs (if you ignore the save issue). In EoMr, you will get for a particular spell always the same damage, regardless the actual caster level you have. For more power you have to spend more spell points - as it should be. The Expanded Psionics have a similar system (but only in this regard), so you can look at the results without paying.

 

[Planesdragon]

I use a spell-point system in my game, and have for more than a year now. It's essentially the same system as in UA, with tweaks and expansions that are more me changing the rules to fit my setting than tweaking the D&D rules.

Two changes that I've made are easy-metamagic (just pay 2 pts per "level", and you get the effect), and mana dice. Each class that casts spells gets some number of mana points rolled randomly, plus a bonus from their Essense Score, and these return at 1/caster level/day.

Throw in the rules for multicasting, setting persistent effects, and the rest--and I've got a great system that I'm loath to share wildly on the 'net.


OTOH, I'm in Albany--not that far away from MA.

 

[mercucio]

Love the spell point system.

It's worked great in the couple of adventures I have run to test it. The flexibility is great. I have discovered one thing: sponteous caster's either need more SP at higher levels or non-spontaneous spellcasters need less. Otherwise the difference between sorceror and wizards narrows a lot.

 

[Cheerful Coffin]

The spell-point system is very well balanced I believe, it is tempting to burn your mana on high level spells, but to do so will limit your casting ability dramatically. (Kind of like Blackmage and how he's so hadoken happy..)

If anything I'd say it weakens more so then assists magic-users as spells per day you are garanteed to have atleast that many times of casting of that spell level at your disposal allowing many more options. Where as spell-points makes you become a bit more conservative and a bit of a preplaner.

*Spell-point spellcaster*I COULD cast fireball and destroy this giant right now.. but that's three arcana points, hmm.. maybe I should just cast a magic missle or two, that way I atleast can do SOMETHING later..

*Spell-per-day spellcaster*I COULD cast fireball and destroy this giant right now.. but why waste my only level 3 spell slot? I'll incenerate the dork with two magic missles instead and if we come across another one THEN I'll bring out the nukes mwaha!

 

[Impeesa]

I'm using Elements of Magic Revised (available on RPGnow, a thread regarding to it is in the EN Publishing forum), which has nice and functionable spell point system, but throws out the division between arcane and divine, so it could be something, which would be too much of a change to you.

Basically, with spell point systems like from Unearthed Arcana there is the caster level problem. Until the 11th level you would only cast fireballs, because you get for the same amount of spell points a better result - only damage caps prevent/hinder the use of fireball in higher levels, at least for the BBEGs (if you ignore the save issue). In EoMr, you will get for a particular spell always the same damage, regardless the actual caster level you have. For more power you have to spend more spell points - as it should be. The Expanded Psionics have a similar system (but only in this regard), so you can look at the results without paying.

Um.. the UA spell point system has that too. All damaging spells only do the minimum damage, and it costs 1 additional SP per caster level to bring it up to whatever your actual maximum would be.

--Impeesa--

 

[A'koss]

I'm using my own spell point system and the flexibility is loads of fun. It takes such a burden off the game but you do have to balance it. Total flexibility, particularly at higher levels, is too valuable without contol. We use a system with a relatively low number of points but allow for somewhat speedier recovery. Every spellcaster has spell point recovery rate and for every full hour of rest (at any time of day) you can recover a small number of points. It takes 10 hours rest to recover a full compliment of spell points so the math is pretty easy.

We have some other checks and balances but those would stray beyond what you're trying to do here. The outline above is balanced enough.

Cheers!

 

[HellHound]

While I like Spell Point systems (and particularly LOVE the one in Elements of Magic - some amazing work by developers that I am VERY proud to be publishing), for my home games I stick to the core Spells Per Day.

A lot of this has to do with playtesting though - my home games are playtest zones for a lot of material, and making sure that the characters are fairly 'core rules' based is important in playtesting new material.

 

[Verequus]

Um.. the UA spell point system has that too. All damaging spells only do the minimum damage, and it costs 1 additional SP per caster level to bring it up to whatever your actual maximum would be.

I don't have UA and I won't buy it - it has too many rules, I'll never use, so it is for me a waste of money. Nonetheless interesting, that the designer thought of that pitfall.