Spell Point System to Replace Standard Spell Progression?

[Sundragon2012]

Hi,

I am interested in an OGL spell-point system that I can integrate into a setting I am working on, one that can replace the level progression/spell usage charts used by wizards, clerics and other 3rd parts core classes. I like the Midnight setting's mechanic but it seems underpowered for a setting that may not be magic-rich but isn't as magic-sparse as that setting. I'm looking for a spell point mechanic that can work with a setting that falls somewhere between Tolkien and Forgotten Realms.

Does anyone know of such a system?


Chris

 

[Crothian]

There was one in Magic by AEG I think

 

[Sundragon2012]

There was one in Magic by AEG I think

Thanks, I own that one....packrat that I am....but never really utilized it. Let me check it out.


Chris

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Also The Elements of Magic.. authored by a board resident here named Ranger Wicket. It can be bought from RPGnow.

He has a supplement, TEOM: Lycanium Arcana (sp ) that goes beyond the base mechanics.

Well balanced, altho using the system slighltly alters the campaign as some things are easier than others and wizards become much more versatile. I highly recommend it, and the supplement.

As to integrating, TEOM uses a Caster Level {CL} to track the characters access to points and lists. In some cases, integrating is as simple as pulling the classes spell progression out and giving it a CL progression. CL from all sources stack. The variety of classes are mainly re-created by availability of the spell lists they can get to...

umm. short comment on lists. Its not the RoleMaster list thing. Its components of spells. So if you know Create: Nature and Move: Force you can design a spell that conjures a lockpick set from thin air and allows you to manipulate the lock from a nice safe distance away

The 'bad' side of the system is that, as a DM, your players can pull alot of interesting things out of the TEOM hat. Using the system will challange your planning a bit more than any other system I have seen.
Well worth the effort, IMHO, as you can also challenge the players assumptions as to what can be done..

My Necromancer BBG recently whipped up a flaming, flying skeletal beast to defend his retreat.... hehehe

 

[Viashimo]

To the best of my knowledge, Unearthed arcana also has a variant for a spell point system in D&D.

 

[Cheiromancer]

A very simple system is to make a spell cost (spell level+1) spell points (cantrip = 1 point, 9th level spell = 10 points). A wizard would get 1 spell point as a 0th level caster, then a number of points equal to his new level whenever he levels up. So 1+1 = 2 at first level, 2+2 = 4 at second level, 4+3 =7 at third level, and so on. Bonus spells for specialization and high abilities aren't measured by spell points; you just get them.

Anyways, this is close to the spells/day progression for wizards at low levels, but is weaker at high levels. Which is as it should be, because high level wizards are imho too strong. And anyways it is the cost for increased flexibility. To replicate sorcerers, just give them +2 spells/spell level per day.

 

[Jack Simth]

You could also snitch the Psionic system from the Psionics section of the SRD, re-flavor so that it is "magic" rather than "Psionics" and come up with some rules for converting spells to powers (mostly a matter of scaling - remove die damage caps, but instead of things going up by your caster level, your "effective caster level" is the number of "Magic Points" you put into the spell, but you must put at least as many "Magic Points" in as you would have for a minimum caster level for the spell - thus, you can put 15 "Magic Points" into a Fireball to get 15d6 damage out of it (and incedentally, you need a caster level of 15 to be able to put that many points in....) but you can't put less than 5 magic points into it (because it is a 3rd level spell - minimum = (spell level * 2) - 1)).

 

[Sundragon2012]

Good replies guys...this is a big help.

I am particluarly liking the idea of cantrips=1 point to lvl 9=10 points where casters get one spell point per level/per level gained. This is a system I was already considering but wasn't sure. Plus, coupling that with the freedom to cast from any spell actually known gives great flexibility at the cost of a bit of power.

Very nice, this just might work.

Hmmm....though I am very attracted to The Elements of Magic, I'll have to see about that. I kind of like the great freedom implied by those mechanics.

Oh.....decisions....decisions.


Chris

 

[Tatsukun]

A very simple system is to make a spell cost (spell level+1) spell points (cantrip = 1 point, 9th level spell = 10 points). A wizard would get 1 spell point as a 0th level caster, then a number of points equal to his new level whenever he levels up. So 1+1 = 2 at first level, 2+2 = 4 at second level, 4+3 =7 at third level, and so on. Bonus spells for specialization and high abilities aren't measured by spell points; you just get them.

Anyways, this is close to the spells/day progression for wizards at low levels, but is weaker at high levels. Which is as it should be, because high level wizards are imho too strong. And anyways it is the cost for increased flexibility. To replicate sorcerers, just give them +2 spells/spell level per day.

Wait, doesn't that give a wizard a choice of 2 cantrips OR one 1st level spell at first level? Isn't that much weaker? I like the simplicity of the system, but a 1st level wizard should have 5 points (plus bonus). I don't think 1st level wizards need nerfing.

Maybe have the PC start out with a number of points equal to his INT bonus, then add from there?

Let's look at the number of points the wizard gets in the PHB (before bonuses, specialization)

Level --Points
1--5
2--8
3--11
4--16
5--20
6--27
7--34
8--43
9--52
10--63
11--74
12--87
13--100
14--115
15--130
16--147
17--164
18--183
19--191
20--201

So, who can come up with a system (function?) that roughly makes that progression?

-Tatsu

 

[Sundragon2012]

Wait, doesn't that give a wizard a choice of 2 cantrips OR one 1st level spell at first level? Isn't that much weaker? I like the simplicity of the system, but a 1st level wizard should have 5 points (plus bonus). I don't think 1st level wizards need nerfing.

Maybe have the PC start out with a number of points equal to his INT bonus, then add from there?

Let's look at the number of points the wizard gets in the PHB (before bonuses, specialization)

Level --Points
1--5
2--8
3--11
4--16
5--20
6--27
7--34
8--43
9--52
10--63
11--74
12--87
13--100
14--115
15--130
16--147
17--164
18--183
19--191
20--201

So, who can come up with a system (function?) that roughly makes that progression?

-Tatsu

Ah,,,I see what you are doing...just breaking down the relative point per level values of spells gained and using them as the spell points. At least I think that's what you did....nice.

Very usable, maintains the relative spell power of the class while increasing flexibility.


Chris