Spiritual Weapon issues

[Felnar]

Yes. The text in the PHB (not included in the SRD) specifically states that the SW does not get a flanking bonus nor help a combatant get one.


Pretty much ruins the threatening concept, IMO.

Why cant it threaten but not help gain flanking?
Does the PHB specifically noting that "[a SW] does not get a flanking bonus or help a combatant get one", mean that without that statement the SW would get/grant a flanking bonus? By this reasoning, it would threaten (the only way i know to get/grant flanking bonuses).

Jester, have you tried comparing Spiritual Weapon in power to Summon Monster II?

 

[Jhulae]

Without that statement, there would be people who would argue that it would grant/receive flanking, which is why it specifically says it doesn't threaten or provide/receive flanking bonuses.

 

[Diirk]

Jester, have you tried comparing Spiritual Weapon in power to Summon Monster II?

Lets try that.

Spiritual Weapon advantages:
* Immune to damage, hard to get rid of compared to SM
* Force effect, so it has no miss chance vs incorporeals (many SM critters don't have magical attacks so can't hit them at all!)
* Not subject to DR
* Longer range
* Not subject to speed limitations
* Quicker to cast

SM advantages:
* Can threaten, flank
* Not subject to SR (except for spell like abilities and the like)
* Can be used for non-combat uses as well
* Doesn't need to remain within medium range of caster.

Other:
* SM critters often do more damage per round than spiritual weapon; however this depends on the level and the critter in question.
* SM can be killed, and has alignment restrictions. SM and SW can both be dispelled. SM can be warded off with Protection From xxx. A few other specific counters for each spell; banishment/dismissal vs disintegrate/sphere of annihilation.
* Not taking up room can be a plus or a minus for SW depending on the circumstances.

Personally I think they're pretty well balanced against each other, SW doesn't need additional benefits like threatening/flanking etc.

 

[Felnar]

Without that statement, there would be people who would argue that it would grant/receive flanking, which is why it specifically says it doesn't threaten or provide/receive flanking bonuses.

i'm fairly certain the PHB does not say that a SW doesn't threaten

Jester, now that i think about it, SW is size tiny, so it has no reach, so it must be in its opponents square to attack. So even if it doesnt block charging, its oppenent does. As for blocking unfriendly movement, you could rule that the SW is only unfriendly to its assigned opponent.

 

[the Jester]

Jester, now that i think about it, SW is size tiny, so it has no reach, so it must be in its opponents square to attack.

Aha, now this is an answer I can get behind.

Thanks!

 

[Brain]

Yeah, I agree (basically the same thing I said earlier in the thread)

 

[the Jester]

Jester, now that i think about it, SW is size tiny, so it has no reach, so it must be in its opponents square to attack.

Crap, I just realized what a can of worms opens if the deity's favored weapon is a reach weapon.... :\

 

[Christian]

I'm sorry to hijack this thread, but this just cracked me up ...

Surely a Bigby's ___ing hand occupies space?

I understand not wanting to offend Morrus' grandmother. But I'm not sure I'm familiar with that spell. Is it in the BoEF, maybe?

 

[dedicated]

A tiny weapon would be about the size of a playing card.

Would a floating playing card block movement?

 

[Jhulae]

Crap, I just realized what a can of worms opens if the deity's favored weapon is a reach weapon.... :\

It doesn't matter whether the diety's favored weapon is range, reach, 'standard', or even a catapult. It ends up 'tiny' and inflicting force damage against one opponent.