(Spoilers) Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix

[Shadoe's Lady]

If there isn't a very good reason for Dumbledore failing to give the Defense Against the Dark Arts job to Snape[1], whether he wants it or not, I'll be very disappointed with Rowling. The man's not very likeable, but he is on the right side, and he's more than competent.

[1] Potions experts being difficult to find is not good enough. A poor potions teacher hurts the students a lot less than a poor Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher.

Not giving Snape the job again (and again and again) might help Snape's cover. If he looks like he's on Dumbledore's good side then it makes him look...well...good.

 

[Barendd Nobeard]

Overall, I really enjoyed this book. The final battle kicks! Fred & George kick! Professor McGonagall kicks! Bellatrix Lestrange kicks (even if I pictured her as a lame goth wanna-be)! Hermione kicks--leading Umbridge to her death! (Didn't know you had it in you, Granger [Barendd Nobeard wipes a tear of joy from his eye]) Ron kicks! Weasley is our King... And I can't wait to see Neville kill Bellatrix in the final book. Oh yes, our boy will do us proud; I'm sure of it!

But I have to ask myself: Has Harry learned nothing since starting at Hogwarts? Every novel has him deliberately decided not to tell Dumbledore about something, which everyone can plainly see has significance. For example, Harry doesn't tell him about the diary (or being a parsel-tongue) in CoS. Then, in this book, he doesn't tell him that Umbridge is torturing him during detention. I don't think Dumbledore would stand for the physical torture of the students, and Harry is an idiot for not reporting Umbridge when it happens. I don't buy Rowlings "he's too stubborn to give Umbridge the satisfaction of complaining" reasoning.

I think I have just switched sides and I am now rooting for Voldemort. Harry's too stupid to live.

I also don't think the parents of Hogwarts' students would put up with whippings being allowed, though they may not have been informed of that yet. Sounds like the kind of thing Umbridge would just declare on the spot, to get Fred and George.

And Rowling cried when she wrote the death of S.B.? Why? It was a total waste and not very meaningful. J.K., get some happy pills from the local shrink, you need 'em, honey! I was pissed (mentaly Raging, actually) when I thought Arthur Weasley was gonna die, and even more angry (Frenzied Berserker angry) when I thought it would be McGonagall. And after all that, we get Sirius falling through an arch? Yawn. Good riddance to a "great wizard" who couldn't see the danger his own house elf provided.

 

[drothgery]

Not giving Snape the job again (and again and again) might help Snape's cover. If he looks like he's on Dumbledore's good side then it makes him look...well...good.

What's more important, Snape's cover or a generation of British wizards finishing school with about one good year of defensive magic training?

 

[KidCthulhu]

But I have to ask myself: Has Harry learned nothing since starting at Hogwarts?

I gotta agree with you on that. I don't mind Harry being stupid occasionally, but he's now been stupid in the same way for five books. In every book, something happens, and everyone around him says "Go tell Dumbledore", and Harry says "No" and he suffers as a result. You'd think he'd learn by now.

 

[Shadoe's Lady]

What's more important, Snape's cover or a generation of British wizards finishing school with about one good year of defensive magic training?

But would they actually get good training from him? His private lessons with Harry didn't go well.

 

[Samnell]

I gotta agree with you on that. I don't mind Harry being stupid occasionally, but he's now been stupid in the same way for five books. In every book, something happens, and everyone around him says "Go tell Dumbledore", and Harry says "No" and he suffers as a result. You'd think he'd learn by now.

I think Harry has issues about being perceived as weak. He usually thinks about telling Dumbledore, but seems to have some feeling that he'd lose face if he did. Living a life where he's been treated as brutally inadequate in all things with the Durseleys could bring on something like that.

For ten years all Harry heard is that he was worthless and useless and a burden. Then enter the wizarding world and he's a hero. I don't think Harry's actively egotistical about it, but the sudden, precious news that he had worth is something he's not willing to part with and he perceives immediately going to Dumbledore to solve his problems as a sign of unworthiness. He feels he has to live up to his fame in order to have value as a person.

 

[Samnell]

But would they actually get good training from him? His private lessons with Harry didn't go well.

I've generally gotten the impression Snape isn't a very great teacher period. Except for villain of the book teachers, Hogwarts instructors seem to be very involved in lab like environments and generally relatively supportive of their students' efforts. They might still be strict like MacGonagall, but I can't see Snape being supportive of anyone. His favoritism for Slitherin is more petty adolescent grudges made manifest than any genuine feelings of good will.

I'm sure he's very competent at making potions (and probably Dark Arts too) but he seems to view the job as mostly a chance to heap abuse on less favored students to gratify his own ego. You're probably right that DADA lessons from Snape would go just like Occlumency did.

 

[Storminator]

I thought it was a very satisfying book, too bad I got in late on the discussion.

I LOVED Harry's portayal in OotP. My son is 15, and it read so true. The poorly handled frustration, which goes wrong wether bottled up or released, the fundamental incompetence with girls, the shock of a heavy course load, the bitching at friends, the irrational outbursts... I've seen it all this year. Rowling really writes to the age of Harry brilliantly.

Umbridge was classic. Slowly insinuating her way in to Hogwarts, thoroughly hateable, not a Death Eater, she's a great change-up villian.

After Sirius died in the big battle, I was still trying to figure out which character was going to die. LOL! I thought it was cleverly done. The repercussions of his death seemed to stretch out a long time, and I thought that added depth to the grief scenes.

I thought Dumbledore's explanation was a great way to cover the fact that you can't say your main character has to kill or be killed in a kids story. It's only once the readers grow up that the characters become old enough to learn the truth.

PS

 

[Caliban]

I'm sure a good bit of Harry's temper can be attributed to puberty, but I think something more might be at work as well.

On page 383 of the book, harry is studying Potions, and reads this passage:

"These plantes are moste efficious in the inflaming of the braine, and are therefore much used in Confusing and Befuddlement Draughts, where the wizard is desirous of producing hot-headedness and recklessness..."

He reads the passage a couple of times. I think it might be a bit of foreshadowing that will be explained in a later book: someone has been slipping Harry a potion to make him more volatile and reckless.

 

[WanderingMonster]

I read on the Chamber of Secrets Forums, a theory that add fuel to the "inflaming of the braine" passage that Caliban mentions: Luna Lovegood.

If I'm not mistaken, the passage related to the uses of moonstone as a calmative in poitons. Monnstone...Luna...Moon...Harry needs calming...eh? Eh?