Standing up and Tumble

[Ahrimon]

Is there anywhere where it states that you can use tumble to stand up without provoking an AO? My group has kind of drawn the conclusion that you can with a DC 15 tumble check because tumble let's you move without an AO. This works for us, but I've been wondering if there has ever been an official ruling on it. If it's already in the books/SRD can anyone point it out?

Thanks

Ahrimon

 

[Li Shenron]

IIRC in one of the recent "rules of the game" article about movement, wasn't it mentioned that you can use Tumble to avoid AoO when crawling away 5ft? But didn't mention avoiding AoO when standing up...

 

[Liquidsabre]

Is standing up movement? If so, you can tumble as part of movement to avoid AoO.

 

[Li Shenron]

Is standing up movement? If so, you can tumble as part of movement to avoid AoO.

I am not sure, I think it's a move action but not "movement".

 

[Darklone]

You can tumble during normal movement, standing up is not normal movement, however normal movement itself is not soooo clearly defined.

 

[Korak]

I am not sure, I think it's a move action but not "movement".

Correct, standing from prone is not a "move" action, However, it is a "move action." (note "move actions" in 3.5 were called "move-equivalent actions" in 3.0) That is to say that a "move" action as defined in the PHB includes the use of a listed speed, or alternative movement modes at a penalty to base speed, such as swimming and climbing. Standing from prone is listed as a separated type of "move action" in the same way that drawing a weapon, readying a shield, and others are listed.

As noted under the Tumble skill in the PHB, you may "tumble at one-half speed as part of normal movement..." Both the inclusion of the phrase "one-half speed" (which indicates that there must be a speed to halve) and the phrase "normal movement" (which points towards the specific "move" action as opposed to the more generic "move action") show that you cannot use tumble to stand from prone without drawing an AOO absent house rules.

It is very similar to the way that one cannot make a tumble check to avoid the AOO from sheathing a weapon, also a "move action."

 

[Li Shenron]

Korak makes good points.

Anyway it's my intention to add that it would definitely not be a problem to allow this extra use of Tumble, to avoid AoOs for standing up.

After all, we played all 3.0 without AoOs for standing up and I don't think it was a problem for anyone, right?

 

[Korak]

Korak makes good points.

Anyway it's my intention to add that it would definitely not be a problem to allow this extra use of Tumble, to avoid AoOs for standing up.

After all, we played all 3.0 without AoOs for standing up and I don't think it was a problem for anyone, right?

That's not a bad house rule. I would allow such a tumble check at DC 25 and as an alternative, a DC35 tumble check to stand up as a free action, which plays in with another house rule of mine, that any action which normally provokes an AOO does not if it can be done as a free action through some means. This also adds value to class abilities like "kip up" from theif acrobat. Where would you set the DC?

 

[borc killer]

As I recall you can stand up from prone as a free action with a Tumble check of 30... it is in the Oriental Adventures book in the skills section. I don’t have the book on me right now so I am not sure on the number… but it is around 30.

You can also Tumble while you are prone… that part is in the Rules of the Game article about movement: “Tumbling While Crawling: Though the rules don't say so, there's no reason you can't can tumble 5 feet as a move action when prone. The check DC is 20.”

I found both of these rules to work great.

Borc Killer

 

[MichaelH]

Perhaps allow the Tumble check to avoid the AoO when standing up from a prone position, but instead of a static DC, make it an opposed roll of Tumble vs. the attack roll of the AoO.