Static Saves

[Vicar In A Tutu]

One thing that bothered me in Star Wars Saga Edition, was that players no longer rolled saving throws. Instead, the jedi/sorceror/whatever rolled against a static number. I think this ruins some of the fun. My players love rolling saving throws, it gives them a feeling that they "fight off" the effects of some evil spell, giving them more control of their character and whatever ills the character might face. Some of the best moments in my campaigns have been characters rolling vital saving throws, the suspense before the roll can be very enjoyable. I think its dissapointing that this (likely) will be lost in 4E.

 

[F4NBOY]

The dice fun is just being flipped from defense to offense.

 

[Vicar In A Tutu]

The dice fun is just being flipped from defense to offense.

Yes, but isn't this less fun for the players? Isn't it cooler to roll the dice yourself and determine your own destiny, rather than watching someone else rolling the dice that could kill your character?

 

[Shieldhaven]

Um. It's really not too complicated to switch it back, you know. This entire topic was discussed in detail in the 3e Unearthed Arcana in the "Players Roll All The Dice" section. You can even set it up so that the players roll to resist spells (defensive) and to beat the enemy's natural resilience (offensive).

Haven

 

[F4NBOY]

Yes, but isn't this less fun for the players? Isn't it cooler to roll the dice yourself and determine your own destiny, rather than watching someone else rolling the dice that could kill your character?

Maybe.
Anyway, doesn't it happen all the time in combat? Attack roll against static AC?

 

[Majoru Oakheart]

Yes, but isn't this less fun for the players? Isn't it cooler to roll the dice yourself and determine your own destiny, rather than watching someone else rolling the dice that could kill your character?

That already happens every time the DM rolls an attack roll against you.

Plus, it works in reverse as well. Isn't it more fun to cast a spell on the enemies and roll it yourself to see if it succeeds rather than the DM just saying "Sorry, your spell fails to affect them"?

It's fun both ways, it's just a matter of who is rolling the dice. This way it makes the mechanics the same with attacks and spells. New players will find it easier to understand that when they do something, they make an attack roll and roll for damage whether using spells or weapons.

 

[Lot]

Yes, but isn't this less fun for the players? Isn't it cooler to roll the dice yourself and determine your own destiny, rather than watching someone else rolling the dice that could kill your character?

Yes and no, I think. While having to make the save or die has led to some exciting moments in my gaming experience, this is more in line with an enemy making an attack roll against you. Also, it goes the other way. Now, if you cast a spell against an enemy, you get to roll to see if your spell succeeds. No more will you cast your best spell to watch your DM roll a 19 and make it worthless.

 

[WhatGravitas]

New players will find it easier to understand that when they do something, they make an attack roll and roll for damage whether using spells or weapons.

Same here. The consistency of "I'm doing, thus I'm rolling" is easy, simple, and quite logical (proactive = doing something; reactive = being passive).

Cheers, LT.

 

[ruleslawyer]

Um. It's really not too complicated to switch it back, you know. This entire topic was discussed in detail in the 3e Unearthed Arcana in the "Players Roll All The Dice" section. You can even set it up so that the players roll to resist spells (defensive) and to beat the enemy's natural resilience (offensive).

Haven

A link for the interested:
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/adventuring/playersRollAllTheDice.htm

We use this IMC, exactly for the reasons Vicar in a Tutu brought up (fun for the players). Now they get to feel like the success or failure of their rolls determines everything. Works well.

 

[Brother MacLaren]

One big difference with static saves is that you will no longer have a case where the character with Ref 19 (base 10, save bonus +9) makes his save and the character with Ref 20 fails his.