Statting up powerful beings

[Sound of Azure]

As I'm reconstructing my campaign setting again, I got to thinking about the spirit world of my setting. The main campaign area's origin was with two groups of spirits that fought, the blood from their battle creating humankind and other races, both on land and in the sea.

The PCs will presumably come into conflict with some of the spirits through their actions, through the summonings of NPCs, or perhaps just misfortune. Therefore I'll need to stat them up. No problem for the "common" spirits.

However, I got to thinking about the two principle kinds of God-Spirits. Some examples of these races are incredibly powerful, especially the actual spirits the Garuda and Naga re named for. So I wonder is it worthwhile to even stat them up. One of the criticisms of the Deities and Demigods book was of its unwieldly and extensive stat blocks of the deities contained therein. Is it better just to say that they are ultra powerful and leave it at that?

I don't expect the PCs to fight the actual Garuda or Naga lords, but they may want to at some stage. Is it fair to just say they're unbeatable in direct combat?

 

[Corsair]

Are they unbeatable (god like), or just really really really really powerful (CR 25+)?

If you really need stats, pick up BoVD or BoED, pick an archfiend or powerful good guy, and shave off the serial numbers.

 

[Sound of Azure]

I'm not entirely sure which is preferable.

I intend for the game to be epic (as in scope) but not Epic (as in the D&D game term). If I were to stat them up, the elder spirits would probably be CR 25+, but as the PCs are unlikely to top 15th or 16th level it seems like wasted effort to stat the Elders up.

In some way it would be good to formalise them, but is there really a point to doing so if they are so beyond the power of the PCs? That's my dilemma.

As I said above, if it goes far enough that the Garuda release their Executioners upon the world, they'll want to do something about it. Direct combat with the Garuda themselves is intended to be suicide, but I can't count out that the PCs might try.

What I wonder is: Is it any different just saying that something is unbeatable to giving somthing insane statistics and abilities far beyond PC capabilities.

 

[argo]

I'm not entirely sure which is preferable.

I intend for the game to be epic (as in scope) but not Epic (as in the D&D game term). If I were to stat them up, the elder spirits would probably be CR 25+, but as the PCs are unlikely to top 15th or 16th level it seems like wasted effort to stat the Elders up.

In that case, don't stat them up now. IF when the PC's make it to 15th level it looks like they might have to fight one you can stat them up then and let it crush them in fair combat. If they want to take one on before then you just tell them it obliterates them and move on.

What I wonder is: Is it any different just saying that something is unbeatable to giving somthing insane statistics and abilities far beyond PC capabilities.

Not really, no.

 

[Crothian]

What I wonder is: Is it any different just saying that something is unbeatable to giving somthing insane statistics and abilities far beyond PC capabilities.

Don't just say, show. You don't have to have the stats fully developed just have the beings swat away the PCs like flies should they ever attack them.

 

[Alzrius]

My advice is that you just pick an existing epic monster (either from the Epic Monster SRD or the incredible Immortals Handbook Epic Bestiary vol. I) and change the name, and voila, you have the stats for your super-powerful creatures.

Noting the above links, the Epic Bestiary has creatures of a MUCH higher CR than in the Epic SRD. It's the book to buy if you need Challenge Ratings of 50+, 100+, 500+, or even 1,000+. Seriously, it has monsters with CRs that high.

 

[Cedric]

This might not be what you had in mind, but in my custom game worlds, if I intend for Gods or beings of Godly power to have any direct interaction with the world...

I use the old Primal Order rules (I don't think they are in print any longer, but I'm sure you could dig up a used copy). Here's a short rpgnet snippet about it. http://www.rpg.net/news+reviews/reviews/rev_2459.html

Basically it was a rule system that you could bootstrap onto an existing rule system to add Gods to the world.

It was built on a system of Primal Energy, which you can get from various sources (Planes, followers, etc). You could use the energy for raw magical attacks against other gods, to build things, to answer direct prayers. You could lace a spell you know (if you're a spell caster) with primal energy to make it blow through any resistance and prevent any saves, as well as doing max damage.

It was a very robust system of rules.

Cedric

 

[BOZ]

Not really, no.

actually, the difference is, in spending your time creating something that nothing could ever possibly defeat (witness the Mortiverse) as opposed to just saying "you can't beat it," and be done with it.

 

[Sound of Azure]

My advice is that you just pick an existing epic monster (either from the Epic Monster SRD or the incredible Immortals Handbook Epic Bestiary vol. I) and change the name, and voila, you have the stats for your super-powerful creatures.

Noting the above links, the Epic Bestiary has creatures of a MUCH higher CR than in the Epic SRD. It's the book to buy if you need Challenge Ratings of 50+, 100+, 500+, or even 1,000+. Seriously, it has monsters with CRs that high.

Holy Mother of Poot!

Don't just say, show. You don't have to have the stats fully developed just have the beings swat away the PCs like flies should they ever attack them.

Ah, so just ignore them pretty much, and give them a scare. Cool.


Perhaps it might be appropriate to have a show of force long before the PCs would ever be in a position to confront them? That, and allude to the power through the old legends.

I guess I posted this up because I that it would seem too arbitrary to simply say they are so strong and far beyond the direct power of the PCs.

In any case, thanks for the answers, all.

PS: Btw, the Primal Order rules look pretty spiffy. Thanks Cedric!