Stealth is useless in low level dungeon crawls.

[Christian]

If a PC isn't trying to be stealthy the monsters get a 25 perception check behind a door. Pretty high but ok no problem they're not trying to be quiet anyways.
If the PC's are being quiet they get a +5 to their hide ability.. great mines at 12 now so it would be 1d20+17 although we would roll the lowest stealth check.. in my party that would be the warlord 1d20+3 (He has a -1 armor check penalty and -1 dex penalty.) When moving quietly that would go against the monsters passive perception unless they where actively listening.. ok assuming passive it's 10 plus any modifiers. Otherwise it's 20 plus any modifiers.
I really don't see how this is breaking stealth. If anything it's encouraging people to try and move quietly through a dungeon.

OK, I haven't seen the book yet, but this explanation doesn't make sense to me ... Suppose the monster had a +4 Perception check, so a passive perception score of 14. If the party isn't trying to be sneaky, the monster needs to make a DC 25 from the other side of the door--impossible, whether active or passive. If they are trying to be sneaky, then they have to make a Stealth roll against the passive perception of 14, or opposed by the active perception check (I'm not sure when you'd use which); with the Warlord's penalty, this leads to about a 50% chance of the monster hearing them.

So, if you don't try to be quiet, it can't hear you; if you do, it might. How is this not discouraging the use of Stealth?

 

[Contents May Vary]

OK, I haven't seen the book yet, but this explanation doesn't make sense to me ... Suppose the monster had a +4 Perception check, so a passive perception score of 14. If the party isn't trying to be sneaky, the monster needs to make a DC 25 from the other side of the door--impossible, whether active or passive. If they are trying to be sneaky, then they have to make a Stealth roll against the passive perception of 14, or opposed by the active perception check (I'm not sure when you'd use which); with the Warlord's penalty, this leads to about a 50% chance of the monster hearing them.

So, if you don't try to be quiet, it can't hear you; if you do, it might. How is this not discouraging the use of Stealth?

Christian is right - there's something wrong here. I tend to agree with others that it is a misprint. Alternatively, it might have been explained badly in the DMG.

Either way, I expect to see a clarification from WotC at some point.

 

[ozziewolf]

OK, I haven't seen the book yet, but this explanation doesn't make sense to me ... Suppose the monster had a +4 Perception check, so a passive perception score of 14. If the party isn't trying to be sneaky, the monster needs to make a DC 25 from the other side of the door--impossible, whether active or passive. If they are trying to be sneaky, then they have to make a Stealth roll against the passive perception of 14, or opposed by the active perception check (I'm not sure when you'd use which); with the Warlord's penalty, this leads to about a 50% chance of the monster hearing them.

So, if you don't try to be quiet, it can't hear you; if you do, it might. How is this not discouraging the use of Stealth?

Ah! I see what you guys are saying now... yes that has to be a typo as they're not going to intentionally make it easier for monsters to hear you when moving quietly versus not.

There are a few typo's in the book actually so it's not unprecedented. Most are rather harmless for example the halfling second chance encounter ability:

When an attack hits you, force an enemy to reroll the attack again. The enemy uses the 2nd roll, even if it's lower.

In that example it should say even if it's higher. In these situations it's best to just go with what they ment and not how they typed it. (The passive 10+5 makes more sense than a dc 25.)

Evidently I fail at reading comprehension and didn't realize it until the last post. I realized it couldn't be a dc 25 the players had to beat as they're not rolling stealth checks and there is nothing else they can roll against that. So it has to be the monsters perception beating the DC... my bad. (I blame it on being early still.)

/edit: Gah bad run on sentence.

 

[Xorn]

I agree that it's a misprint. If the players make no attempt at stealth, then it's 10 + 5 for the door, DC 15. But unless my players state, "I'm going to roar as loud as I can before I kick the door in!" (I'm referring to you, ozziewolf ), then I'll use the lowest character's Take 10 stealth check +5 for the difficulty through a door.

 

[ozziewolf]

I agree that it's a misprint. If the players make no attempt at stealth, then it's 10 + 5 for the door, DC 15. But unless my players state, "I'm going to roar as loud as I can before I kick the door in!" (I'm referring to you, ozziewolf ), then I'll use the lowest character's Take 10 stealth check +5 for the difficulty through a door.

Hey give me some credit it was at the same time as I kicked the door in.. and in my defense.. I was a Dwarf who preferred a straight on fight to sneaking around.

 

[Xorn]

That was your dwarf pirate, right?

 

[ozziewolf]

That was your dwarf pirate, right?

Die in a fire...

(My group teased me endlessly because my Dwarven accent sounded more like a pirate accent to them... every ones a critic!)

 

[Surgoshan]

My next dwarf (ranger) is going to sound like the swedish chef.