Stepping over "The Line" in a campaign

[Quasqueton]

During our game last night, the PCs were about to do something that might have Very Bad repercussions – one of those things that could haunt them for a long time in the campaign. It’s not often the Players recognize a moment where they can see “The Line” they are about to step over; usually the line isn’t recognized until after it is crossed, if it is ever actually noticed at all. A concept for this moment was briefly discussed, in jest at first, but then half seriously: the “Save” button.

One Player mentioned he could bring his Staples (office supplies store) Easy Button (a novelty they sell based on their TV commercials) to use as the actual button. The game host has a photocopier where we could photocopy the character sheets for reference if we ever needed to “reload” from the saved spot.

Anyway, we gave it a good 5 minutes of fun discussion, and then moved forward, stepping over The Line in the campaign.

My questions, today:

Have you ever noticed The Line in a campaign before you stepped over it?

What do you think of the Save button concept for D&D?

Quasqueton

 

[lukelightning]

I notice things like this...."do we open the sealed door to the Lost Temple?" that sort of thing.

I've joked about saving the game...the DM says "what do you do?" and I say "well first I save the game in case I die...."

But I would never dream of actually introducing a "saved game" mechanic. That's just too cheesy, and breaks the idea of the game.

 

[Mycanid]

Hmm ... well, admittedly I have noticed it before, but usually right when others were about to step over it.

I remember one adventure one of the pc's opened a box he was told not to repeatedly. He decided to anyway. As he was doing so my pc (an elven fighter/magic user - this was in 1e ADnD days) leapt through the window of the 2nd story of the Inn they were at and ran like mad.... He was badly hurt from the fall but was the only pc to survive. All others were toasted immediately by an upset deity. Needless to say that was the end of THAT adventure/campaign.

As for the idea of the Save button? Hmm ... to be honest I never really thought of it. On the one hand it might be a good tool for pc's who are just learning the game, on the other it could easily give way to abuse. I guess it would be allright if everyone agreed to it before the game started. I could see it's use, say, in the original Tomb of Horrors. I much prefer the absence of it in the game, though.

 

[Dragon Vindaloo]

I think Dragon actually introduced a magical itam that was basically a 'save point crystal' or something very much like that in one of the sillicon sorcery articles.

 

[SiderisAnon]

Was That The Line Way Back There?

My questions, today:

Have you ever noticed The Line in a campaign before you stepped over it?

What do you think of the Save button concept for D&D?

Unfortunately in my game, I generally have to point out the line loud and clear to the players before they step over it. Sometimes, they realize they're about to ruin their own lives, but some of my players have a real knack for coming up with things to do that will haunt them if not completely ruin their lives. They not only don't realize they are crossing the line, they have such a mind block against it that they will argue for hours or days if I let them about how what they did was perfectly appropriate. As best I can tell, they are simply so enamored by the idea of no consequences in the game that they're unable to see them.

One of my favorites was when the party was in far part of their country and ended up chasing a local peasant. (They made a mistake and thought he was someone else, so that was valid.) They chased the guy into the village, where the local lord was just briefing his large hunting party. (Who were about to go after an owl bear that the PCs had come here to kill.) In rides this well-armed party chasing one of his peasants. The lord demanded the party throw down their weapons and explain themselves. The party not only refused, one of the characters drew his lance and charged the lord. The end result was the lord and a number of his men died. The party had lost some horses to fireball in the fight, so they appropriated some of the lord's horse (they did leave a "reasonable amount" of money, so they thought the horse things was okay). The players never could understand later why they were up on murder charges. (Which is why I don't game with some of them anymore.)


As for a save button, if a player ever suggested that not in jest, I'd tell him to go play Neverwinter Nights instead because this isn't a video game.

 

[sckeener]

I've toyed with the idea of a 'save' point. I think it would speed up player's making decisions sometimes if they knew they could 'reload'.

The problem I had was I couldn't figure out how to do that with the DM stuff. I mean there is a ton more usually on the DM side than what is printed up that we keep track of in our head.

 

[BlackMoria]

A savepoint? Let me think on that a moment...

NOT! Smacks to much of a computer RPG. D&D is more fun for me playing without a 'safety net'.

Crossing the Line - most of the time, it gets crossed because noone has recognized it as such.

Other times it gets crossed (or not) because that is the point or purpose serving the story or plot at the moment it presents itself. Do you or don't you. Ah, but for a crystal ball looking into the future to see how it play out before you cross it.

Your fate and the fate of the world is before you. Do you or don't you do 'X'?? <evil chuckle>

 

[lukelightning]

Bah! Fie! I just do things and accept the consequences, and if they result in my character's demise, then there's always the option of bringing them back, or, more often, making a new character.

In a computer game, if you didn't have a "save" function you'd never be able to end the game before the finish, and you'd always have to start from the beginning. Luckily D&D is free of those constraints.

 

[XO]

If you must...

...and sometimes it would be best, why not have a deity of Fate and multiple paths.

Should the PCs commit suicide accidentally, or stupidly, they may be deemed obliterated, BUT, their alter egos live on in a parallel fate path.

Saves a lot of headaches.

 

[GwydapLlew]

I've instituted a house rule than a player can spend 5 Action Points to survive something that would have killed him - it allows for the 'I thought he was dead' moments in my campaign. It's not been used by players yet, but the rules for it are simple: you are out of commission until I deem otherwise, and you come back at a point I deem fitting for the story.

Example: Black dragon breathes acid and the PC drops to -10 hp. At the end of the battle, after the surviving PCs have fled, the PC regains consciousness and finds himself alone in the swamp, with most of his gear destroyed.