Str of Kadun, too powerful?

wraith8 · Sep 1, 2003

The R&R spell strength of kadun gives an enhancement bonus equalt to caster level to str for a certain amount of mins dependant on caster level....
This is the same as the str domain feat only it is more than one round!

What an overpowered Spell!

Sacrusha · Sep 1, 2003

Hrrmm... after reading through the spells, do you think R&R is a balanced book overall? I am asking myself if it is still worth getting it.
(No trolling, this is a serious question as I don't own that book)

wraith8 · Sep 1, 2003

r&r decent

Actually, some of r&R's spells are good, but some are inbalenced....
R&R2 is

ty as hell.

i figure its good to have the book so you can look through it and pick spells that are good and ok......
House rule the badones out and take only the balenced ones.....

The belsameth's blessing spell jairami uses is completely unbalenced making it not worthwhile at all to get the lycanthrope template...... I mean imagine K krusher, using str of kadun and bel's blessing instead of the weretiger template...... Hed get more levels in each class as well as increased str...
Its insane...

Sacrusha · Sep 1, 2003

Take a look at Bite of the Werebear at WotC's website.
Or Giant Size from OA for monks and other unarmored folks.

(As long as noone wants to keep these things secret in the arena I am willing to give them away, just ask if you have a character idea and want to improve it, I never had the need to copy one yet.)

wraith8 · Sep 1, 2003

Im curious since bite of the werebear gives an enhancement bonus and belsameth's blessing is a race bonus (i think) cant you use both together?

James McMurray · Sep 1, 2003

wraith8 said:
Im curious since bite of the werebear gives an enhancement bonus and belsameth's blessing is a race bonus (i think) cant you use both together?

Technically yes. Its a bit silly, but it works that way. Bite of the werebear should hav given a racial bonus, then it wouldn't increase the strength of werebears that get it.

For the most part, R&R is fairly weell balanced. There are a few spells that aren't done right, and afew that need tweaking. Strength of Kadum is fine if you require clerics to also have the material component, since it hard to find a creature with 40+ strength to get blood from.

Belsameth's blessing is fine if you remove the part about the caster getting Improved Control Shape. K. Krusher could be screwed if he were a lycanthrope that couldn't control himself. He can at least break out of a frenzy, but once he changes, he's stuck on the ground while you blast him from the sky.

Darklone · Sep 1, 2003

James McMurray said:
For the most part, R&R is fairly weell balanced. There are a few spells that aren't done right, and afew that need tweaking. Strength of Kadum is fine if you require clerics to also have the material component, since it hard to find a creature with 40+ strength to get blood from.

Naaaah. Level 1 spells such as Rage or Smite? These are SILLY. I would say, for a small part, R&R1 is nicely balanced, much stuff belongs into some high magic part of the realms and the rest... should be used in arenas against the game designers favorite character.

wraith8 · Sep 1, 2003

Darklone said:
Naaaah. Level 1 spells such as Rage or Smite? These are SILLY. I would say, for a small part, R&R1 is nicely balanced, much stuff belongs into some high magic part of the realms and the rest... should be used in arenas against the game designers favorite character.

Do you belong to a specific arena darklone?

Darklone · Sep 1, 2003

wraith8 said:
Do you belong to a specific arena darklone?

No specific one... Just one where everyone seems to play a dwarven cleric

reapersaurus · Sep 1, 2003

this is hilarious.
People are JUST NOW finsing out about the hideous cheese that's in R&R, etc?

You guys should have been here a while ago for our SMACK adventure.
Almosat everything that you're asking about here today (wraith) has been in my bag of "cheesy tricks" that I hung up over a year ago, when I made a creature so hideous, I broke melee combat.

Ever since then, I haven't had the heart to put on the munchkin cap again.

I think it's funny that James McMurray STILL has the complete opposite approach to me in just about every rule there is. LOL
Although you're right, James, that R&R wouldn't be so bad IF it had the restrictions you're mentioning, but they don't. So R&R isn't balanced at all. Belsameth's Blessing and Strength of Kadum is all you have to look at to prove that.
Let me put it this way:
For my Strength Smackdown champion (in Jeremy's legendary Smackdown thread here on the boards), I never bothered making a version that used Belsameth's Blessing or Strength of Kadum, because those were so hideous, ridiculous, and obviously broken I assumed nobody in their right mind would allow them in a contest.

And wraith8:

The belsameth's blessing spell jairami uses is completely unbalenced making it not worthwhile at all to get the lycanthrope template...... I mean imagine K krusher, using str of kadun and bel's blessing instead of the weretiger template...... Hed get more levels in each class as well as increased str...
Its insane...

When I first saw RPOL's Arena (months ago), I saw K. Krusher's build, and saw how those exact spells could so easily make a better character than that champion, I dismissed RPOL as not worth the trouble to prove what I already knew.