D&D General Styles of D&D Play

[Hussar]

So the problem is that DMs are bad. Again. Believe it or not, not everything wrong in gaming can be traced to a bad DM.

No, the problem is, the system is pass/fail without any degrees of success or failure. The DM is simply following the rules. A point that has been repeatedly stated in this thread should lead to good results. But, they don't. So, the DM, regardless of being good or bad, is only as good as his or her tools. And the system whereby it's entirely ad hoc adjudication with multiple rolls, gives bad results.

But, sure, twist what I said to mean that I'm attacking DM's. That works too.

 

[hgjertsen]

What that means is, every infiltration attempt will fail. Because the DM will simply keep throwing checks until one fails, and then the whole thing falls apart because every fail is a catastrophic failure. There are no degrees of failure. Did you fail your deception check? Yes, then the other person automatically sees through your disguise and raises the alarm.

Every.... single... time.

Yeah because after all, if your epic break in to the nobleman's mansion comes down to hitting a roll of 10 or higher every time to beat the checks with your plus 5 bonus, you're gonna need to get 1/2x1/2x1/2x1/2x1/2 for just five checks!

 

[Minigiant]

Why not? I fail to see how a tool that does 5 styles decently well is somehow bad simply because it was intended(and you haven't shown that) for only two of them.

It doesn't do 5 styles decently.

Many people in this thread have said D&D overpowered spells break Political, Exploration, Mystery, and Survival games.

 

[Hussar]

Bardic inspiration is good support for those as well.

Hang on, I was told that numerical support and using mechanics was rollplaying. Not role-play. That's been repeated here a number of times.

 

[Minigiant]

It's actually.

I can carry a toddler = Strong support.
A toddler walks with me = support.
I sent the toddler to buy me some whisky = unsupported/allowed.

If it's walking with you, you are holding its hand and/or keeping it safe from coyotes. It may not be the strongest support, but support it still is.

I didn't mention holding its hand.

D&D doesn't handhold in playstyle support. Not 5e for dang sure.

It looks out for stray animals. But 5e does nothing to keep the toddler from walking into a ditch or into the street.

Because "that's not DM empowerment". That's "Telling you how to run your game like the bad ones like 3e or 4e or PF". Guidance Smidance. Examples? What's that?

 

[Hussar]

Yeah because after all, if your epic break in to the nobleman's mansion comes down to hitting a roll of 10 or higher every time to beat the checks with your plus 5 bonus, you're gonna need to get 1/2x1/2x1/2x1/2x1/2 for just five checks!

Oh, it's better than that. Because these are opposed checks - Deception vs Insight. Which means that DC might be as high as 20 (or as low as 1, true) where any single failure is a catastrophic one. 5 opposed d20 rolls? Unless you're a fairly high level rogue with the right skills, you might as well not even bother.

And then DM's complain that their players never do anything but kick in the door and kill everything. Or, better yet, rely entirely on spells to do any sort of infiltration/exploration.

 

[Maxperson]

It doesn't do 5 styles decently.

Many people in this thread have said D&D overpowered spells break Political, Exploration, Mystery, and Survival games.

Except that they don't. They only break those styles if you ignore the spells and try to run those styles as if the spells don't exist. If you embrace the spells, you can do all four styles easily. You just have to account for the magic when you do it.

 

[Hussar]

Except that they don't. They only break those styles if you ignore the spells and try to run those styles as if the spells don't exist. If you embrace the spells, you can do all four styles easily. You just have to account for the magic when you do it.

I'm not sure that counts as "supporting a style" when you have to change the style to fit the system. Wouldn't a system that supports as style actually support that style, not the other way around?

 

[Maxperson]

Hang on, I was told that numerical support and using mechanics was rollplaying. Not role-play. That's been repeated here a number of times.

Numerical support can enhance roleplay just fine. It's not all or nothing. If you do nothing but roll dice to accomplish everything then you are rollplaying. Simply using numbers alongside of roleplay doesn't switch it from one to the other.

 

[Maxperson]

I'm not sure that counts as "supporting a style" when you have to change the style to fit the system. Wouldn't a system that supports as style actually support that style, not the other way around?

You aren't changing the style. You are accounting for certain spells. A survival based game doesn't have to be about food being hard to come by and spoiled by create food and water. If the party make-up is such that create food and water is coming down the pike, you can make food scarce before level 5 and then that portion just goes away and all the other survival portions of the game remain.