Subtle Brilliance...

[BryonD]

Now here's a task. Find a way to combine low-magic Grim Tales with high-magic Elements of Magic, and I'll be perfectly happy. A contradiction, I know, but I work under a different assumption of why spellcasting hurts people in pulp fantasy stories.

See, in my mind, most of the villains in the pulps are mid-level mages, trying to cast high-level stuff. If they stuck with charm spells and polymorphs, there'd be no problem. But when they try to kill someone with a word, they're using powerful stuff, and it can kill them. That's just me, though.

I want flashy magic and anime-esque power levels, while still having a flexible class system and a wound system that makes PCs not be able to fight armies alone.

I think you could make this work pretty easily.

First, if a 6th level spell is a 6th level spell, then it does not matter if your spells come from the Core Rules or from any other source.

If you want a system where people can get themselves in trouble for casting spells that are over their head, then this is it. In the extreme a character with a caster level of zero could conceivably cast a 9th level spell (if he had a 19 prime ability and rolled some nat 20s). Very slim chance of success and a virtual guarantee that it would kill him...... But he could go for it.

So just make magic a little more common than is suggested in the base GT system. Then lower the ability prereqs and Spellcraft DCs to lure foolish casters in. Then drop some moderate to high level spells in to the mix. Tweak spell burn and spell burn resistance to the desired level and watch the pretty colors.

Shooting from the hip, you could change spell burn resistance as follows: A caster ignores the first Xd6 dice of spell burn per day, where X is the caster level. However, the caster never knows what the result of Xd6 is from day to day and once they have used it up they take the full brunt of excess dice. So casters could show some real power for a little while each day with no negative effect. And then they suddenly blow themselves up. I'm certain this could use a lot of work, but it may be in the ballpark of achieving what you are thinking.

And it adds a lot of FLASH, so it wouldn't really be GT anymore. But it may be what you want.

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

So, for anyone who's used the system, just how well did the non-spellcasting and spellcasting classes balance with each other?

As RangerWickett said, there are no spellcasting classes.

Anyone can cast spells. To cast spells without risking killing yourself, however, you need the Magical Adept talent. There are further talents in that tree that improve your ability to cast/manage spells, as well as a few feats.

Spellcasting is balanced against the "mundane" world by the fact that (a) it is difficult to find spells, (b) it is difficult to learn spells, and (c) it is difficult to cast spells due to some seriously detrimental side effects.

In a low magic game, spells become inordinately powerful, yes-- but the trade-off in terms of skill points, talents, and feats invested to do it well, along with the side effects, is pretty well balanced.

Wulf

 

[Piratecat]

I am tremendously impressed with Grim Tales, and I get more impressed every time I read it. It's probably because there are no rogues in my normal campaign, but I'm itching to run some sort of Fafhrd & the Grey Mouser/Thieves World game with Grim Tales. Hideous wererats crawling from the sewers, assassins dropping from rooftops, and no fireballs to help the hapless PCs....

I'm also adopting the vehicle rules to replace Spycraft's chase rules. I thought Spycraft's were damn good, but I like this adaptation much better.

 

[BSF]

Boy, all this talk about Grim Tales makes me want to check it out. It sounds like some great stuff. I doubt my LGS will have it, but I have at least one place online that works as an FGS.

 

[Nuclear Platypus]

Now here's a task. Find a way to combine low-magic Grim Tales with high-magic Elements of Magic, and I'll be perfectly happy. A contradiction, I know, but I work under a different assumption of why spellcasting hurts people in pulp fantasy stories.

I was going to ask about that but you beat me to the punch. Thanks. Haven't gotten the book yet but hopefully it'll happen soon. I've an odd idea for a campaign, namely using GT to run OA (with some Rokugan mixed in) but with EoM's magic and some steamtech and get a vague chanbara / wuxia /anime mix (puree?). Perhaps I'm getting too ambitious.

 

[Old One]

Agreed...

Home run. Recently, I'd been having a problem balancing my encounters for my party they've either gotten blown out or walked through it. Using the EL system within GT, I've noticed that in the last two weeks the combat's felt dead right. This chapter alone -- these four little pages - should replace the byzantine explanation of EL in the SRD.

Jonrob1,

Agree whole-heartedly. Those 4 pages are almost worth the price of the book and will really help scale adventures/challenges in a meaningful way (as opposed to the "rough eyeball" way that I have been doing it for 23 years ).

The whole deconstruction/reconstruction aspect of GT is one of the things I like the best.

~ Old One

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

I was going to ask about that but you beat me to the punch. Thanks. Haven't gotten the book yet but hopefully it'll happen soon. I've an odd idea for a campaign, namely using GT to run OA (with some Rokugan mixed in) but with EoM's magic and some steamtech and get a vague chanbara / wuxia /anime mix (puree?). Perhaps I'm getting too ambitious.

Heya NP--

If you are going to use Grim Tales for this, I wholeheartedly suggest that you buttress it with "martial arts" style feats either from OA or, better yet, any of the stuff from Vigilance (Blood and Fists, etc.)

There are not a lot of "martial arts" style feats in Grim Tales-- but you'll have no problem adding feats/feat chains from other sources.


Wulf

 

[S'mon]

OK... must get this... must get this...

 

[S'mon]

*ouch* just checked Leisure Games, *£23.99* + p&P?! *eek*

Is it really worth $40/£24?

 

[Wulf Ratbane]

*ouch* just checked Leisure Games, *£23.99* + p&P?! *eek*

Is it really worth $40/£24?

The US retail price is $34.95-- if you're familiar with Bad Axe pricing, you'll understand that's as low as I could feasibly go.

Unfortunately, I don't have any control over the local Euro pricing.

If Amazon is an option for you, we are carried there (and other book trade outlets).

Wulf